Topic: How the hell do people play FPSs with gamepads?

[Xessive]

Yep, thanks Pug, that's what I was talking about.

[HxCeddie]

The thing with me is that since my PC is so god awfully bad, I'm usually forced to buy console versions of FPS. Because of this, I actually think I've gotten far better using gamepads instead of the m/kb in FPS. I know it sounds crazy, but I'm so much more comfortable using the sticks, and if you put the sensitivity all the way, I feel that it's almost the same speed with which you can move the mouse around.

I know it sounds crazy, but it's not THAT big of a difference between the two, I think that it's just more preference, whether you want to chill on a couch or sit in a computer chair.

[Quemaqua]

In every single competitive circumstance ever where kb/mouse setups were pitted against controllers, the kb/mouse setups dominated by ridiculous margins every time.  For SP, I agree either is completely doable.  Controllers work fine once you get used to them.  As mentioned, I never found them particularly uncomfortable.  However, to say that there isn't that big of a difference between the two is silly.  There's a huge difference, which competition shows.  You get *way* the fuck more out of a mouse, period.

[Pugnate]

Never say that again.

 

In every single competitive circumstance ever where kb/mouse setups were pitted against controllers, the kb/mouse setups dominated by ridiculous margins every time.  For SP, I agree either is completely doable.  Controllers work fine once you get used to them.  As mentioned, I never found them particularly uncomfortable.  However, to say that there isn't that big of a difference between the two is silly.  There's a huge difference, which competition shows.  You get *way* the fuck more out of a mouse, period.

hahaha.... look you are right. Whenever I've seen competitions where PC gamers take on console gamers in a competition the PC gamers win hands down.

But HxCeddie and Jedi aren't disputing that I don't think. Since they game a lot on consoles and not so much with keyboard/mouseys, at this stage they find it easier to use the sticks. I probably would as well if I was gaming 99% of the time using sticks and hadn't used a mousey as much.

I don't think that is invalid. Again I can't do jack with an analog stick and feel so uncomfortable around consoles that I have games like Metroid Prime 2, Resident Evil 4 and a whole bunch of other gems lying around. That's how allergic I am to consoles, and obviously do find the keyboard/mousey set up superior.

However if I grew up around sticks, or if that came to me naturally, who is to say I wouldn't find that more natural to the mouse and keyboard.

edit:

Just corrected mice to mouseys

[Quemaqua]

Well, obviously there's a difference in opinion, I was just trying to say that I think there *is* actually a huge difference, even if you're comfy with a controller.  I'm not arguing that they might be pretty good with them and find them comfortable, or even more comfortable than a mouse.  I was just referencing the comment that there isn't that big a gap, because I think there's a pretty vast one.

edit:

Just corrected mice to mouseys

 

[Xessive]

Remember when FPS on the PC didn't use the mouse at all? i.e. Doom, Duke Nukem, Quake.. Even Quake 2 when i first started playing I strictly used the keyboard.. My controls were: arrows to rotate and move forward/backward, A & Z to look up and down, Space was jump, Shift was walk/run, CTRL was fire, and ALT was the my strafe modifier. I was perfectly content with it, but mostly because I had autoaim.. Quake 2 did not have any autoaim in multiplayer, so I had to learn to use the mouse to get some accurate shots, especially with the railgun.

I think that's why I won't play console FPS games, especially not in multiplayer. The need to be pinpoint accurate is there, but they lack the tools. I can feel all that inferiority and I won't allow myself to regress since I've already developed the skill to use a mouse to aim.

[MysterD]

I been PC gaming since Duke 3D and Quake 1.

Yeah, once the mouse got involved, things got GREAT for FPS's!

[HxCeddie]

I haven't really seen competitions where the both control types have been pitted against each other, but I just find a gamepad more comfortable.

Hmmm...maybe we need to set up our own experiment to see how different it is. I think it could be fun actually.

[idolminds]

The main issue here is speed, not just in controls but the games settings. The reason controllers get smoked online in PC games is because the PC gamer are designed for a mouse. Lots of vertical space in the levels, everyone moves fairly quickly, and can also aim very quickly.

Console shooters are generally much slower than PC FPSs. You cant run as fast, jumping is slower, aiming is slower, etc. Its a level field because everyone is using the controller, the game is designed around it.

So really, pitting a PC player with a MKB setup vs a console player with a controller depends entirely on the game you choose to play. Counter-Strike? PC wins, the game is designed around mouselook. Halo? Its much more even...its a slower game overall, and they even go as far as having max mouse sensitivity feel "slow" to PC gamers.

[Pugnate]

There was a tournament earlier between the editors of PCG vs the editors of the official Xbox mag.

PCG won though not quite easily.

[Cobra951]

It's not just speed.  It's speed, accuracy, and linear response.  It's the speed to pinpoint.  (Ramping up stick sensitivity lowers pinpoint accuracy.)  The mouse is a much-better analogue for head and eye movements than a thumb stick.  OK, I'm beating this to death.  I happen to think there is no other way to look at it, from experience.  I guess that's obvious.

Doom had a 5-degree wedge for aiming.  Anything inside that arc would be hit by your shots.  (I mean single bullets.  The shotgun is even more forgiving, and can hit multiple targets.)

Once mouse freelook came into the picture, it took over.  I don't think it was even one of the big games that introduced it.  I first used it in a Terminator FPS game (not the one that got popular, but before it--I forget names).  The paradigm shift in control went from weird to indispensable.  Mouse replacing keys is obviously a huge improvement for looking/aiming.  I can see that there would be an argument about whether it's a huge improvement over analog sticks.  I think so.  I did use joysticks for some games, even before mouselook.  I even used 2 of them for Mech Warrior 2 (movement and turret--i.e., looking).  In later mech games, that turret function went to the mouse.  So much better.

[Quemaqua]

Pug, I remember that, and it was a slaughterfest.  The one I'm thinking of was a Halo or Halo 2 match, which I think the PCG guys had never played and the other guys played *all the time*.  And, as I recall, it was like 30 to 1 or something ridiculous.  Maybe I'm thinking of a different match, but there was a somewhat recent one that resulted in total embarrassment for the console guys.

[Pugnate]

Hmmm I'll have to dig up the mag, maybe I've got it wrong.

[Quemaqua]

Believe I heard it from the podcast also, btw.