Topic: Zelda: The Phantom Hourglass

[sirean_syan]

Dude(s), I totally forgot the new Zelda was coming out this week.

I may have to go out and buy a new game.

[Quemaqua]

I still need Minnish Cap.  =(

[Cobra951]

Oooh!  I better make sure my DS is in working order.  I haven't even touched it in like 8 months.  I'm sure it needs a charge.  Portable gaming once more.  Can't pass up a real Zelda game.

[PyroMenace]

Gamespots score: 9.0, yay, plus Alex Navarro  is reviewing it.

[Quemaqua]

Yeah, I watched that last night.  He's one of the few remaining guys with a head on his shoulders.

[idolminds]

This game is amazing.

[Cobra951]

Charging DS now . . .

[nickclone]

My expectations of this game were kinda low, but so far I'm liking it even if it is a little chatty.

[Cobra951]

I played for a couple of hours.  It's definitely a welcome addition to the DS.  The control scheme works well, although I prefer D-pad and buttons for anything other than menus, writing, and things which genuinely benefit from screen pointing.  Nintendo is still pushing the technology a little too strongly.  One big negative for me is the use of the microphone, which is never mentioned in the linked review, unless I was half asleep reading it.  That has got to stop.  Does anyone with any sense of self ever yell at their handhelds outside of a desert island?  Give me a frigging button labeled "Blow/Shout".  Christ on the cross.  It's a gimmick through and through, there only to justify Nintendo's design decision to include a mike.  The touch-screen control is at least good enough not to seem indirect (which it really is, for character actions).

Anyway, the game plays much like any other Zelda game otherwise.  Yep, she's been kidnapped again.  Time to get rupees and hearts, swing that sword, and go figure out temples.  The graphics are very nifty for the DS, looking close to Wind Waker's.  I think as long as silent puffs of air gets me through the microphone nonsense, I'm going to enjoy it as a Zelda game.

[idolminds]

I have to agree on the mic, probably the least used/wanted feature of the DS. Luckily most games don't do any sort of voice recognition so if they ever want you to yell or shout, you just blow into the mic.

I'm loving the map stuff in this game. I just love maps so having to draw stuff or mark places on my map is awesome.

[JacksRag(e)]

Also, if you register the game you're eligible for a feather DS stylus.  It's not much, but it's a nifty little present.  This coming on the heels of the 5 stylus Brain Age 2 pack, too.  Nice.

[nickclone]

Have you guys tried taking it online yet? Its kinda fun, its like playing tag and hide and seek.

[idolminds]

Haven't taken it online. I will once I'm done with the main adventure.

I just have to complain about the dungeon that you need to visit over and over. The concept is kind of cool, and its where the Phantom Hourglass actually comes into play. Dunno if you read the reviews, but I'll give you a quick rundown.

There is this dungeon on the first island. It is cursed and will "drain your life". It doesn't actually drain your life, it has a timer. When the timer runs out I guess you die. Dunno, haven't had it run out. The timer ticks down as you run around, but there are special safe areas you can stand and wait where the timer freezes.

There aren't many enemies in the dungeon, but these big roaming guards. Its kinda Metal Gear-ish...stay out of their vision cones and sneak around. They can't see you in the "safe zones", so hooray for waiting. If they do see you and manage to hit you, they take a big chunk of time out of your hourglass. Oh yeah, and you can't kill these dudes.

So thats the basics. You need to return to this dungeon several times as you get more hourglass sand and items that will help you go deeper into the dungeon. Some of the items will let you make use of various "shortcuts" through the dungeon so you have more time as you go down.

The problem is there aren't enough shortcuts. Theres one checkpoint floor about 5 levels down. So I can go from the entrance to the checkpoint and skip all those other floors. It keeps your best time through those first few floors and subtracts it from your total time, so you can re run those levels to get a better time, if you want. I got mine down to 2:02...I'm happy with that.

But the remaining floors need to be beaten. Again. I have to gather these stones from around the map and place them in special holders in other places around the map while avoiding these guards and all the other traps and do it as quickly and smoothly as possible to still have time on the clock for later floors.

There needed to be better shortcuts. I don't want to replay most of these floors to completion again. Let me bomb a wall and go down a floor, let me use my arrows to hit a switch and go down a floor. Just don't make me solve the same freaking puzzle AGAIN for no real reason.

Its a bummer.

EDIT
Found one shortcut, got my first few floors down to 1:45..and that was even when I found a different area and lost a little time.

[Cobra951]

What happens when time runs out is that your life starts draining.  When your hearts run out, you die.

I haven't played the game much lately.  I solved the fire temple, and that's been about it.  I still don't think too highly of the control method.  It's all well and good for writing and menus.  I want direct control over Link.  It's OK, just needless, there more for tech-demo reasons than for actual control enhancement.  The one thing which totally sucks is the rolls.  I have a very hard time rolling to the right.  For some reason, it works better to the left, but it's still nothing like reliable.

I watched the video review on this, and endlessly repeating that cursed dungeon is something I'm not looking forward to.

[idolminds]

Yeah, doing rolls sucks. A tip is dont try to make a little circle like the game tells you, just make a quick move "back" from the direction you're heading and it usually does a roll. And do it at the edge of the screen, of course. It helps that the roll so far is never really needed.

Other than that, though, I'm fine with the touchscreen controls. Link seems to be doing everything I want him to be doing.

[Cobra951]

I'll try that, thanks.  Yes, the controls are generally OK, really.  The only bad thing is the rolls. I think I mihgt start using my Axim's stylus, though.  My knuckles are getting irritated by the back of this stubby little stick from the DS.  If I hold it by the middle, my hand gets in the way of the screen.

[JacksRag(e)]

I think the way to roll is to slide the stylus back and forth on the edge of the ds screen that's in the direction you want to roll in.  That sounds confusing right now to me, but it's my method.  I just barely slide the stylus back and forth on the edge of the screen and Link rolls towards that direction.  I don't know why Nintendo chose their description of little circles to explain. Buh.

[sirean_syan]

I finished the game today. As far as Zelda games go, it's easily not my favorite one. That said, it had a lot of high points.

The control with the stylus worked well enough for normal stuff (once you got used to it), but all the extra control you have over the items was great. The same goes for making notes on the maps, but it got annoying that every time someone gave you a clue or a hint they told you to write it down. It was nice the first couple of times before I got used to having it, afterwards it was just like the game didn't expect me to grow.

A lot of the dungeons were to easy, and I remember that being a problem with the Wind Waker. There's at least some justification here as a portable game with long drawn out dungeons wouldn't work out so well for quick gaming sessions. You could tell that was what they had in mind because all the dungeons had shortcuts that you'd open up along the way so if you had to stop playing you wouldn't lose much progress. The repeating dungeon also got to be a pain, but in the end I think it was my favorite one of the bunch because it just had the most interesting stuff.

Finally, I'm still not a fan of boating around to get to places. It feels like it breaks the game up instead of making it bigger, mostly because each place is so small. Again, I suspect it was somewhat deliberate to make the game more portable, so I don't know if I really want to fault it that much here.

So yeah, it was fun and all that, but I'm sorta glad the game is done. What it did do was make me want to try to get into the Twilight Princess again and go at a real Zelda game. It seems all the portable Zelda all make me feel like that, although I never played those season ones that came out on the Game Boy Color. Something about them just feels a little off.

[Cobra951]

I just can't get into it.  I've yet to make it through that life-sapping dungeon once, since I got the hourglass.  I make it into the 3rd level, then I screw up somehow, and am expected to repeat the whole process.  I don't have the patience, so it's been in the drawer for about a week and a half.

Edit:  The Seasons ones are good.  Minish Cap (GBA) is great for a portable.  I liked all of those.

[sirean_syan]

I had to force myself through the repeating dungeon through those middle runs. Thankfully I never failed and had to restart at the end, but things just aren't that fun until you get a lot of toys to play with in there. Otherwise, you spend way too much time in the safe zones.

Oh yeah. I totally forgot about the Minish Cap. That one was actually pretty great. There was a little too much meaningless item collecting for my taste, but that's all optional and other stuff was really enjoyable.

[Quemaqua]

I love meaningless item collecting, and I still haven't played Cap.  Been meaning to get it for ages now and just still haven't.

[idolminds]

I liked the collecting of boat parts but I never found very many by the time I beat the game. And while using more parts from the same set gave your boat more durability, they didn't have any other effect. Would have been cool like a full Demon boat would scare monsters away so they wouldnt attack, or other stuff. It was just looks. By the end of the game I never had even one full set.

[sirean_syan]

I hope all of you who purchased the game registered to get that feather stylus. I got mine today; it's a cute little trinket and I'm happy to have it. I'm not sure if I'll ever use it, but it's a nice little package to add to the collection.

[nickclone]

I kinda stopped playing this game, but I still have it if anyone wants to play online.

[gpw11]

So, after giving this an initial try on someone else's DS soon after it came out i decided to get this about a week ago.  I think i'm done with it. Don't get me wrong - it's Zelda and I like it a lot.  Hell, i even sort of like the control scheme.  What I can't stand, however, is the fucking mix of repetitive dungeons and stealth.  I could probably manage to go through the temple of the Ocean King over and over again if it was well designed, and the first couple levels weren't bad, but after the half way point it's just retarded.  If you're going to make someone go through the same floors over and over again, why the fuck would you make them stand there and wait for guards to pass you in some shitty stealth sequence as well?

I think i'll just play Minish Cap instead and try to get either GC Zelda game going on an emulator.  Worst case scenario, i just play through OoT again.

[Cobra951]

What I can't stand, however, is the fucking mix of repetitive dungeons and stealth.  I could probably manage to go through the temple of the Ocean King over and over again if it was well designed, and the first couple levels weren't bad, but after the half way point it's just retarded.  If you're going to make someone go through the same floors over and over again, why the fuck would you make them stand there and wait for guards to pass you in some shitty stealth sequence as well?

This is the essence of why the game is intolerable to me.  If you read my posts here, you'll see that's why I stopped playing.  This is the only Zelda game since 3 that I have ever started and not finished.  (1 and 2 I discovered as emulator curiosities, and they felt too primitive by then for me to get into.  It wasn't anything about the game structure itself that stopped me.)  It's a great disservice to the franchise, and even to the rest of the great work in PH (which becomes a waste as a result of this).

[gpw11]

I do remember reading your posts and was actually thinking about that before I got it, but for some reason i kind of imagined it being more tolerable.  I kind figured that you were turned off because you were totally suprised going into it and it was unbearable, but I'd be braced for it, knowing it was a chore needed to be done to progress.  Yeah, i was wrong and it's something i can't really look past.

It actually didn't bug me all THAT much until the fourth time through (coincidentally, when the halfway marker appears).  I walked into the next room and was like "you know what?  Fuck this.  Sneaking past these motherfuckers once isn't even fun."

Mental note: listen to Cobra more.

[nickclone]

I didn't finish this game or Wind Waker because I didn't like being forced to explore the environment. Apparently, they're making a new Zelda title for this DS thats supposed to come out this year.

[gpw11]

Yeah, I saw that - Spirit Tracks or something.  A train instead of a boat.  That's cool and i'm all over it as long as they don't do something stupid like put in a shitty repeating dungeon.

[nickclone]

Yeah, I saw that - Spirit Tracks or something.  A train instead of a boat.  That's cool and i'm all over it as long as they don't do something stupid like put in a shitty repeating dungeon.

I had my DS for about four years now and I don't like being forced to use the touch screen. I did have fun with the wifi, but the game was flat otherwise.

[gpw11]

Really?  I wouldn't say the touch screen is a draw for me in any way, but it's also not something I avoid using.  I actually kind of liked it in The Phantom Hourglass.

[gpw11]

New Spirit Tracks Trailer

I gave up on Phantom Hourglass because of the repeating dungeon and gave up on Majora's Mask just because there was a lot of other stuff going on (like Borderlands, Last Remnant, and anything that didn't involve watching jerky n64 animation).  As long as there's no repeating dungeon in this I'm so in.