Topic: Left 4 Dead

[MysterD]

I just think it's quite simple with Left 4 Dead -- people like zombies, whether being a zombie or fighting against them.

I dunno how that can get boring, even with the same few maps.

[Pugnate]

Well actually there are more like 20 maps. Only the scenarios are limited, but each has multiple maps.

[MysterD]

Well actually there are more like 20 maps. Only the scenarios are limited, but each has multiple maps.

Very true.

I still want to see more scenarios, so I'm lookin' forward to DLC and what people plan to do with the Source SDK for L4D.

[PyroMenace]

You know I was listening to the commentary on how at first they were designing the levels to be open areas and you had to find your way to the rescue area. The problem that arose was players tended to be overwelmed quickly and once they learned where the rescue area was they would take the same path to it over and over. But then I thought, why couldnt they design it to have multiple rescue areas and make it randomized. I wouldnt care how easily overwhelmed the zombies could be, that would make the rescue that much more thrilling and accomplishing.

[MysterD]

I do like having set levels and whatnot, but having another separate game-mode where it randomized the start and exit areas -- ooh, that'd be interesting.

Why not? The AI director lakes to randomize where enemies get placed.

[Quemaqua]

That's a pretty awesome idea.  I imagine that would be somewhat difficult to mod in, but man, that would be an awesome mod.

Also, I'm mad.  I thought I beat the first campaign on Expert today, but it turns out the server reset to Advanced at some point (that or the difficulty never switched properly to begin with and I didn't notice).  I was very sad.

[gpw11]

I'm kind of sad to see they're still using the same online 'browsing' system, which is to say none at all.  I don't know if it has something to do with it being late at night or what, but I have a really high ping on every game I've tried.  Like unplayable connection problems.  Seeing as I can't see what game I'm connecting to, it's hard to say if it's something on my end, or there just aren't any servers on this side of the world available.

[Pugnate]

I'm kind of sad to see they're still using the same online 'browsing' system, which is to say none at all.  I don't know if it has something to do with it being late at night or what, but I have a really high ping on every game I've tried.  Like unplayable connection problems.  Seeing as I can't see what game I'm connecting to, it's hard to say if it's something on my end, or there just aren't any servers on this side of the world available.

Yea that matchmaking pissed me off as well. But just activate console through the options, press "~" for the console drop down, and enter "openserverbrowser" to have the standard Valve server browser popup. From there you can just easily sort servers by ping.

I can't believe Valve didn't make that a standard thing for L4D PC. You shouldn't have to jump through hoops to use a standard server browser.

I do like having set levels and whatnot, but having another separate game-mode where it randomized the start and exit areas -- ooh, that'd be interesting.

Why not? The AI director lakes to randomize where enemies get placed.

Add some more depth, and you could have a Diablo-esque action RPG. A Hellgate:London if you will, that actually didn't suck.

[Quemaqua]

The server stuff in this game sucks ass, period.  It's totally borked.  Connections are often terrible if you leave the thing to its own devices, the matchmaking sucks, and trying to run a server is an exercise in frustration due to bugs and stupid behavior.  These are the big problems with the game.

But if you use the server browser and play with buddies, things are much alleviated.  Now that the OWnet server is running without issue that should help, at least when others are around to play with.  How do you ping to that?  I know it's a bit variable.  But it seems like one can deal with a ping of 200ms or so without it being too noticeable.  The game is a little more forgiving about it than some, and I think it might have some kind of lag compensation in place...?  Not sure on that one.

[MysterD]

I love this game, but again, just like with HL2, I really wish Valve would stop pretending like it has a fucking story.  They go on and on about the story it tells and how important story is to them and blah blah blah... shut the fuck up!  This game has no story.  Yes, it has a nice setting and some good background, and even some decent character personalities, but IT HAS NO STORY.  IT HAS NOTHING EVEN RESEMBLING A STORY.  It barely even has a coherent progression.  Oh, you rode off in a boat at the end of the 2nd campaign, and then for some reason at the start of the third you're in some kind of... greenhouse?  And you didn't even just walk into the greenhouse, you're in a boxed corner of it with no door surrounded on the other side by zombies.

Yeah, there's no real connection b/t the scenario -- they're all separate tales from each other. I would really like to see somehow, all these scenarios get some sort of map(s) and/or scenario(s) in-between them that connects all of these events/scenarios into one huge epic storyline.

Despite my annoyance with how often they refer to story, they did a remarkable job making the characters interesting and believable.  I mean, these are just dudes you control in an FPS... personality wasn't *really* that necessary, but it really adds to the replayability because of how their dynamic and random conversations work.  It keeps things entertaining and personable sometimes even when action isn't going on, and it does make each character a hell of a lot more distinct.

The character interaction is great. Every time I play each scenario, you seem to learn a little tiny bit more background and info about each character and their personality, if nothing's really happening on-screen. Yeah, the banter between the characters is really good.

[gpw11]

The server stuff in this game sucks ass, period.  It's totally borked.  Connections are often terrible if you leave the thing to its own devices, the matchmaking sucks, and trying to run a server is an exercise in frustration due to bugs and stupid behavior.  These are the big problems with the game.

But if you use the server browser and play with buddies, things are much alleviated.  Now that the OWnet server is running without issue that should help, at least when others are around to play with.  How do you ping to that?  I know it's a bit variable.  But it seems like one can deal with a ping of 200ms or so without it being too noticeable.  The game is a little more forgiving about it than some, and I think it might have some kind of lag compensation in place...?  Not sure on that one.

I pinged to that fine.  I think it was between 90-150 or something which is great.  I take it it's at your place? 

[Quemaqua]

Yeah, it's here.  Nothing fancy, I don't even have a dedicated box or anything, but it doesn't really need one.

[MysterD]

L4D might get patched this week to ONLY fix some issues on the PC version.

Yes, DLC will be coming sometime later after this patch, in the future -- for X360 and PC still at the same time.

[gpw11]

Okay, so I haven't been able to sign into STEAM for the last two days.    I get a 'could not connect to STEAM network' error.  Please tell me they're having server problems, because I've been using STEAM pretty consistently for over a year and haven't run into this at all.

[Quemaqua]

All's well on my end, for once.  I've been logged on for days and the server has been up for like a week or something.

[idolminds]

Steam just got an update, and the L4D update went live. They are probably getting hammered.

[gpw11]

Hopefully.  I don't see what it would be on my end since nothing has changed since the last time I was in, but last night I couldn't get in.  Router and firewall settings the same, blah blah blah.  I don't feel like figuring out if all of a sudden my isp and STEAM don't work together so well or something.  At first I thought i might be putting in the wrong password, since it asked for it the first time this happened, but I changed it alright and still no go.

[Quemaqua]

Steam just doesn't work properly.  The sooner you accept this, the easier things will be.

[Ghandi]

I tried to log into STEAM once and it killed my dog. True story.

[gpw11]

It works now.  I don't have a dog but my cat's still alive, so that's cool.

[Pugnate]

Careful with 'em STEAM jokes. I smell a MyD close by... you do not want to startle a MyD with STEAM jokes.

[gpw11]

So, like, are other people complaining about this horrible lobby system or have they tricked themselves into thinking it's great?  I mean, it's alright as an option, but they really should have a server browser available by default without having to go into the console to bring it up.

[Pugnate]

Look back in this thread to reply#163.

[PyroMenace]

Heh yea I guess it does kinda suck, but I never have to worry about it because this is a game I wouldnt want to play with random people, just friends only.

[MysterD]

PC Version got their patch today. So, get on Steam and update it, if you got it already...

X360 version owners, you're gonna have to wait a few weeks for your patch over XBL.

Left 4 Dead Update Released
January 14, 2009, 5:11 pm - Jason Ruymen - Product Update

Left 4 Dead has been updated with a host of fixes, tweaks and new features, including enhancements to Versus mode for improved competitive play. The full change list is below. For PC users the update will be applied automatically via Steam. Meanwhile, the update will be made available to Xbox 360 players in the coming weeks.

General

    * Fixed Survivors being able to climb surfaces marked for versus infected only
    * Fixed a class of SurvivorBot bugs dealing with rescuing downed players
    * Players can no longer grab ladders while flying through the air after a Tank punch
    * Shooting near a car with an alarm that has already fired the alarm will no longer make chirping noises
    * Improved loading time
    * Fixed mini-gun physics exploit
    * Fixed propane tanks (and other physics objects) causing players to fall through elevators
    * Fixed rare achievement bug issues
    * Fixed several map exploits
    * Fixed various match making issues
    * Fixed NAT traversal issues


Versus Changes

    * Added HUD elements to show status of other infected players
    * Changed color of infected player name in chat to red
    * Fixed exploit where players could spawn infected bots
    * Fixed instance where a Survivor changing to the infected team would be attacked by infected bots
    * Normalized special infected melee damage
    * Made the following client commands cheat protected: "Kill" and "explode"
    * Fixed exploit where infected players could run away and teleport back to gain health
    * Players can only change teams once per map
    * Players can't change teams while other players are still loading
    * Tank spawns at the same % through the map for both teams in versus mode
    * Made the Tank and Witch spawn directly on the escape route
    * Increased chance of getting the Tank or Witch
    * Fixed team swap issue


Hunter

    * Easier to pounce a Survivor who is meleeing
    * Increased Minimum damage a Hunter pounce does


Smoker

    * Fixed Smoker tongue tolerance
    * Smoker now has to be killed or the tongue destroyed for the tongue to break
    * Survivors cannot bash someone off the tongue until the Survivor being pulled is paralyzed or hanging
    * Tongue attacks that fail to paralyze or hang a Survivor will use the shorter ability delay timer
    * Fixed cases where the ability timer was not using the correct time
    * Fixed case where you could point at a Survivor but not register a tongue hit
    * Fixed Smoker tongue not targeting and landing properly through PZ ghosts
    * Smoker tongue does damage every second while dragging paralyzed Survivors


Tank

    * Bashable objects now appear with a red glow
    * Tanks hitting a car with an alarm disables the alarm permanently
    * Tank frustration timer is only reset by hitting Survivors with rocks or fists
    * Reduced autoshotgun damage against Tanks


Witch

    * Witch spawns at the same % through the map for both teams
    * Avoids spawning within a certain % of the tank
    * Fixed an exploit where the Witch could be woken up and tricked into attacking Survivors

[Xessive]

I wish L4D was cross-platform.

[MysterD]

I wish L4D was cross-platform.

Ooooh, that'd be REALLY interesting...

[Quemaqua]

Seem like good changes in the patch there.  My only wonder is if the Infected stuff changes universally or just in versus?  I'd not prefer to have the two be different from each other.

[Pugnate]

* Players can no longer grab ladders while flying through the air after a Tank punch

awwww...

[Quemaqua]

Yeah, I thought that was stupid.  How often does that even happen?  And why get rid of it?  That's fucking epic if you can somehow do that or get lucky enough to be punched into a ladder.

[Pugnate]

That's fucking epic if you can somehow do that or get lucky enough to be punched into a ladder.

Exactly. Someone send a letter to Valve. I am too lazy.

[MysterD]

Exactly. Someone send a letter to Valve. I am too lazy.

You love Valve.
Go do it.
NOW.

[Pugnate]

*slaps D*

[Ghandi]

Yeah but that was one of D's funnier moments. You can't slap him for that.

I got your back, D. This Valve fanboy can go suck it.

[Pugnate]

Aren't you late for your goat pr0n shoot?

[MysterD]

*slaps D*

*slaps Pug with a Valve-labeled bat*

[Pugnate]

Leave it to D to carry one of those.

[MysterD]

Leave it to D to carry one of those.

With your name written on it.
And a big-ass Steam symbol.

[Pugnate]

ummm... so I've played more L4D, and it is very close to being my ideal zombie game, at least in terms of mechanics and atmosphere. It shoots for realism, and is pretty much what I love about it.

[MysterD]

L4D is as great as it gets, for zombie shooters.

I really can't wait to see a L4D supported SDK; mods; and new official and unofficial maps come its way. If Valve can bring that, I can see myself taking a long while to decide to uninstall L4D.

Most games, once I finish them, they'd be lucky to be remain on my HD.