Topic: Diablo 3 is here and ITS AWESOME!

[K-man]

I will be there with you, Keebs...provided ol' bessie can handle the game.

[Quemaqua]

But D2 operated exactly in that manner...

No, D2 had a single player mode that didn't operate in that manner at all.

[angrykeebler]

No, D2 had a single player mode that didn't operate in that manner at all.

Most people were playing the D2 multi over the single player even when high speed internet wasn't widely available. I remember playing multiplayer on my shitty dial up connection after barely having touched the single player campaign. Now that (nearly) everyone has high speed internet, the disparity between the two will probably be even greater..especially since you can have the single player experience (e.g the story) on-line.

[Quemaqua]

So what? My point is that there were people who used it, myself and Cobra included. I'm sure many others did as well. And don't give me "most people", you don't have the slightest idea what the ratio of SP to MP was for users of the first two games. Likely there were people who did a fair bit of both and also people who had no interest in ever taking it online, just as there were people who played online exclusively. Regardless, my point was only that the other games offered it and this new one doesn't. That's a precedent that's being broken. You may not care, but your viewpoint doesn't speak for everyone. Yes, I'm sure the game will sell twelve bajillion copies just like every other Blizzard property, and I'm sure most people will just be fine with it and do whatever, and *I* don't even care *that* much because I no longer spend my entire life playing videogames, but it irks the fuck out of me when somebody acts as though nobody else's preference matters, that whatever they happen to think should be the norm should be the accepted standard for everyone. People have every right to be annoyed that they have to partake in a "service" just to play a fucking videogame. Generally speaking, I don't want to sign up for anything, I don't want a fucking username, I don't want to give them my email address or my credit card or tell them where I live. I just want to put the disc in the drive and play the goddamn game I just bought. Given that this is an established property which had a single-player mode that didn't require Battle.net in the last 2 games, it's entirely reasonable to be disappointed in the changes being made. If I actually bought D3 it likely wouldn't matter to me as I'd be buying it to play online with Sy, but Cobra enjoyed both of the prior games in a different way, and I think it sucks that he's being ignored by Blizzard when he's just as much a fan of the games as anyone. More than I am, even. I played a shitload of D2 online and off, but Cobra seems to have done way more in the SP than I ever did, period.

[K-man]

The bottom line is that single player mode is absent from this game.  The game requires a persistent internet connection.  The only method of play is by logging into Bnet, and the limitations that Idol listed above existed in Bnet D2 play.  So it's a little absurd to be surprised by those limitations.  That's what I'm referring to.  You can't compare offline SP in D2 to D3 because there are no comparisons to be made.

I know people are pissed about the lack of offline mode, but that wasn't my point.  My point is that the requirements and limitations for D3 mimic precisely the requirements and limitations for D2 (apparently right down to the random server drops).

[Quemaqua]

Yes, it may otherwise be exactly the same, but all I was trying to say is that Demon's Souls was a new franchise and chose how it was going to do things. Diablo is an established franchise and it sucks that Blizzard has decided to change the gameplan, because they've already established a different precedent. I think that's shitty. It doesn't affect everyone, but it pulls the rug out from under others.

[K-man]

Got pushed back to early 2012...

[Cobra951]

The bottom line is that single player mode is absent from this game.  The game requires a persistent internet connection.  The only method of play is by logging into Bnet, and the limitations that Idol listed above existed in Bnet D2 play.  So it's a little absurd to be surprised by those limitations.  That's what I'm referring to.  You can't compare offline SP in D2 to D3 because there are no comparisons to be made.

I know people are pissed about the lack of offline mode, but that wasn't my point.  My point is that the requirements and limitations for D3 mimic precisely the requirements and limitations for D2 (apparently right down to the random server drops).

Why is it absurd to be surprised?  I wasn't merely surprised by this development; I was shocked.  (I mean yanking away offline SP, not just the most recent developments, which only add to the rage.)  Here is an essential game series in my life which, IMHO, is getting borked up the backside, and effectively removed from my consideration--all for self-serving motives, because no one can convince me that this helps any gamer in any way.  If that's not a good reason for me to be pissed, I don't know what is.

And everything Que said above.

[PyroMenace]

Its just the way of the times. I certainly don't agree with an online single player but if you play games, then high chances are, you have internet, and I would say those chances are higher if you were a gamer with a PC that played the first two Diablo games. If you are the minority that doesn't, then you probably have never heard of Diablo. Blizzard is catering to online PC gamers, hell the PC gaming market caters to online gamers. Again, I don't like online SP components in games, but I am privileged enough to have the requirements for them, but Im not going to get all uppity for that small minority that gets left behind.

I can't imagine being a gamer without any access to the web, in fact it would feel so gimped and problematic you wouldn't want to consider gaming as a hobby again.

[Cobra951]

Bizzard are catering to themselves.  No one is saying that online isn't important.

[PyroMenace]

You obviously didnt understand the correlation I just made.

[Cobra951]

You also said I'm part of a small minority.  You can't possibly know that for a fact.

What didn't I understand.  In order to cater to online folks, the company must abandon offline?  That makes no sense at all.

[PyroMenace]

You also said I'm part of a small minority.  You can't possibly know that for a fact.

You're posting here. You can play D3.

What didn't I understand.  In order to cater to online folks, the company must abandon offline?  That makes no sense at all.

PC gamers have internet, they can play D3.

[K-man]

Look, whether or not we agree with the decision is pointless.  I don't agree with the decision but that sure as hell isn't going to keep me from playing it.  It is what it is.
 
If you don't want to play the game out of principle, that's fine.   Online only is a shitty thing, sure.  But I've got the requirements to play it so I'm going to play and enjoy it.

The only person in this forum with a real reason to bitch and complain is Idol, because he will legitimately have no access to the game.

[K-man]

And personally I'd like more talk on how fucking awesome this game is going to be when it comes out.

[Quemaqua]

I actually haven't been terribly impressed with anything about it, which is almost a relief. The only things that have stood out to me have been the negative. I have no plans to buy it, less because of ideology and more because it just doesn't seem very exciting or interesting to me. Maybe I've just spent so much time playing these now that I don't care? I don't really know. If I watched/read more that might change, as admittedly I haven't been proactive about it, but the stuff that I've been linked to by friends and whatever hasn't wowed me at all.

[Cools!]

I watched some beta footage. Character animations look very nice and smooth. It's colorful enough to look pleasing without being too much and confusing (at least from what I've seen). Demon huntress character looks nice.

[angrykeebler]

So what? My point is that there were people who used it, myself and Cobra included. I'm sure many others did as well. And don't give me "most people", you don't have the slightest idea what the ratio of SP to MP was for users of the first two games. Likely there were people who did a fair bit of both and also people who had no interest in ever taking it online, just as there were people who played online exclusively. Regardless, my point was only that the other games offered it and this new one doesn't. That's a precedent that's being broken. You may not care, but your viewpoint doesn't speak for everyone. Yes, I'm sure the game will sell twelve bajillion copies just like every other Blizzard property, and I'm sure most people will just be fine with it and do whatever, and *I* don't even care *that* much because I no longer spend my entire life playing videogames, but it irks the fuck out of me when somebody acts as though nobody else's preference matters, that whatever they happen to think should be the norm should be the accepted standard for everyone. People have every right to be annoyed that they have to partake in a "service" just to play a fucking videogame. Generally speaking, I don't want to sign up for anything, I don't want a fucking username, I don't want to give them my email address or my credit card or tell them where I live. I just want to put the disc in the drive and play the goddamn game I just bought. Given that this is an established property which had a single-player mode that didn't require Battle.net in the last 2 games, it's entirely reasonable to be disappointed in the changes being made. If I actually bought D3 it likely wouldn't matter to me as I'd be buying it to play online with Sy, but Cobra enjoyed both of the prior games in a different way, and I think it sucks that he's being ignored by Blizzard when he's just as much a fan of the games as anyone. More than I am, even. I played a shitload of D2 online and off, but Cobra seems to have done way more in the SP than I ever did, period.

dude you can get the same single player experience in multi player.. and if you want to complain and moan that getting a username and needing internet is an inconvenience then i think i've heard enough first-world whining to last me the goddamn week. and seeing as how you have made it abundantly clear that YOU ARE NOT EVEN BUYING THE GAME, then why are you still bitching? it sounds like because blizzard had a single player component in diablo 2 suddenly you are entitled to one for this game.

man louis c.k was right. everything is amazing and nobody is happy



reference:

[MysterD]

Why is it absurd to be surprised?  I wasn't merely surprised by this development; I was shocked.  (I mean yanking away offline SP, not just the most recent developments, which only add to the rage.)  Here is an essential game series in my life which, IMHO, is getting borked up the backside, and effectively removed from my consideration--all for self-serving motives, because no one can convince me that this helps any gamer in any way.  If that's not a good reason for me to be pissed, I don't know what is.

And everything Que said above.

I agree w/ everything Que and Cobra has said. It really sucks that previous games in Diablo franchise had offline SP portion, yet D3 doesn't.
Though, there might still be a chance I'll buy D3...just, unsure of when and depends on price, of course.

I think my big worry w/ successes like Blizzard's D3 is that MORE companies will have MORE games having just a full-blown "always online" game - where the game can be played like a SP game [w/ bots instead of players] ONLY online.
It sucks to see UbiSoft even try having Assassin's Creed 2 PC, which was a SP-only game, be always online for DRM - thank God, most of PC gaming revolted and Ubi listened and pulled the DRM back a bit. I really don't want to see games that are a full-blown SP experience require the silly "always online" component.

I like that games like Sacred 2, Diablo 2, Titan Quest, Borderlands, and many other ARPG campaigns can be played OFFLINE OR ONLINE.

[angrykeebler]

I agree w/ everything Que and Cobra has said. It really sucks that previous games in Diablo franchise had offline SP portion, yet D3 doesn't.
Though, there might still be a chance I'll buy D3...just, unsure of when and depends on price, of course.

I think my big worry w/ successes like Blizzard's D3 is that MORE companies will have MORE games having just a full-blown "always online" game - where the game can be played like a SP game [w/ bots instead of players] ONLY online.
It sucks to see UbiSoft even try having Assassin's Creed 2 PC, which was a SP-only game, be always online for DRM - thank God, most of PC gaming revolted and Ubi listened and pulled the DRM back a bit. I really don't want to see games that are a full-blown SP experience require the silly "always online" component.

I like that games like Sacred 2, Diablo 2, Titan Quest, Borderlands, and many other ARPG campaigns can be played OFFLINE OR ONLINE.

[MysterD]

It's okay - Blizzard's gonna be saving me some $60.
I'll spend my money on something else.
I normally DO NOT buy their games - and most games, for that matter - upon release at full price, anyways.
[shrug]

[angrykeebler]

because torchlight 2 is the new diablo 3 right?

[MysterD]

because torchlight 2 is the new diablo 3 right?

No, not entirely - they'll both obviously be different ARPG's, in some regards.
I'm sure Blizz's production values will be tons better, for starters.
And obviously, both game's settings will be MUCH different [medieval-fantasy/steampunk for TL2 vs. medieval-gothic of Diablo series].

You're taking my points of why I said that completely out of the context that I meant for it.

Torchlight 2 has ALL of the features that I'd really want and expect from a Diablo 3 - LAN support; MP online support; SP mode.
We can go a step further - Torchlight 2 even will have SDK Support.
I really never expect mod support from Blizzard, given past Diablo games.

I also meant - I'll be WAY more willing to drop money on initial release for Torchlight 2 [which will be much cheaper] than say Diablo 3.

[angrykeebler]

I also meant - I'll be WAY more willing to drop money on initial release for Torchlight 2 [which will be much cheaper] than say Diablo 3.

and then never playing it, amirite?

[MysterD]

and then never playing it, amirite?

I have spent $ on Guild Wars and all its expansions - which, might I add, is an ONLINE Only game.
B/c it's online only, you damn right that I didn't buy it at full price.

There's a pretty good chance I will buy D3, at a much cheaper price.

[angrykeebler]

I have spent $ on Guild Wars and all its expansions - which, might I add, is an ONLINE Only game.
B/c it's online only, you damn right that I didn't buy it at full price.

There's a pretty good chance I will buy D3, at a much cheaper price.

enlighten me, how many games do you have in your collection that you wasted money on and never played

[MysterD]

enlighten me, how many games do you have in your collection that you wasted money on and never played

I lost count LONG ago.

[angrykeebler]

[Quemaqua]

Way to troll up the thread while simultaneously missing the fucking point. Kids these days.

[angrykeebler]

Way to troll up the thread while simultaneously missing the fucking point. Kids these days.

i'm only trolling MysterD. It's like the national past time on these boards.


and I forgot why I stopped arguing with you long ago. Oh, right because it's fucking impossible.

[MysterD]

At least those games that I ain't gotten around to, the chances are pretty good they have a SP mode and I don't have to rely on some company's servers just to RUN and BOOT the damn game.

[angrykeebler]

At least those games that I ain't gotten around to, the chances are pretty good they have a SP mode and I don't have to rely on some company's servers just to RUN and BOOT the damn game.

No, they ALL do. If you don't believe me, go install them and find out.

[Cobra951]

dude you can get the same single player experience in multi player.. and if you want to complain and moan that getting a username and needing internet is an inconvenience then i think i've heard enough first-world whining to last me the goddamn week. and seeing as how you have made it abundantly clear that YOU ARE NOT EVEN BUYING THE GAME, then why are you still bitching? it sounds like because blizzard had a single player component in diablo 2 suddenly you are entitled to one for this game.

man louis c.k was right. everything is amazing and nobody is happy



reference:

It's called a forum for a reason.  I'll bitch here every time the spirit moves me.  And no, you can't have a SP experience in MP.  They are fundamentally different, and that includes technical requirements.  The internet is not a technical requirement for SP.

If you all want to ignore Blizzard yanking away your freedoms, that's your choice.  I refuse to bleat along with the crowd, and I will be vocal about it.

[PyroMenace]

Yanking my freedoms away? Really? Do you think that Blizzard is some fascist regime? Then next Hitler? Are they coming for you Cobra?

[Xessive]

I reserve the right and freedom to not buy this game

[PyroMenace]

Joking aside, lets move passed this and get on to something more substantial, like Loot!. The Diablo 3 site has added an armory like database of all the items (I think) so far.

[angrykeebler]

It's called a forum for a reason.  I'll bitch here every time the spirit moves me.  And no, you can't have a SP experience in MP.  They are fundamentally different, and that includes technical requirements.  The internet is not a technical requirement for SP.

If you all want to ignore Blizzard yanking away your freedoms, that's your choice.  I refuse to bleat along with the crowd, and I will be vocal about it.

Fine. But that means I'm allowed to bitch about your bitching.



Whiners.

[idolminds]

This is like an internent meme.

GameFront: While there will be no official mod tools for Diablo 3, does Blizzard condone D3 mods?

Julian Love: There’s no direct intent to say that we don’t want D3 to be moddable. And, to be honest with you, the technology itself, on just a fundamental level, makes this the most moddable version of Diablo there’s ever been.

However, we have these other goals that supersede modding; we want to provide a safe and secure experience for players to play in and trade items in, and in order to do that, we had to make the game online play only. Once we made that decision, that effectively eliminated the possibility of having moddable games, since you’re going to have to connect to our service in order to play. So that’s a slight consequence of our online-only decision.

I’ll say that there’s never really been an intention with past Diablo games to make them moddable, either; it’s just that people found a way to make it happen. It’s not necessarily something we went out of our way to support.

Scumbag Blizzard: Makes Diablo 3 the most moddable Diablo yet; won't allow any mods.

[Cobra951]

Don't insult their sacred cow.  You'll get lynched.

[gpw11]

Wasn't Warcraft III fairly mod-able in MP?  Like, that's where DotA came from...and you'd be connected to their service.