Topic: Borderlands: Diablo with guns

[Cobra951]

What's a 5GB download?  Are the textures that enormous on the PC version?  The biggest DLC on the 360 is Knoxx, weighing in at 1.7 GB.  The others are around 1 GB.

Edit:  Oh, you mean all 4 together?  That makes sense.  Can't you separate them out to 2 discs?

[MysterD]

Aw, man, I could have told you that.  Yeah, extremely lame.  This was a heated subject for a while at the Gearbox forums.  Also, beware of trying to mix retail and Steam versions of Borderlands stuff.  Apparently, that's a no go.

That's usually true w/ most PC games - you usually cannot mix Retail and Steam versions for base games + expansions. Also, you usually can't mix Retail and Digital Download versions. Often, there's different DRM schemes involved.

Usually, you buy one version for the base - you're locked to get all DLC + expansions through the same service. Or, you'll have to re-buy the game somewhere else to get everything.


EDIT:

I just picked up a retail copy of Borderlands GOTY and amazingly enough none of the DLC are on the F'ing disc. It's just regular Borderlands with a leaflet that ahs instructions on how to download the DLC from the Gearbox site.. That's nearly 4GB of downloads (if not more).. Lame. So lame.

Oh, that freakin' sucks! Bah!

If you're a BL Vanilla Retail owner already or own both BL Vanilla + DLC Double Pack (Zombie + Moxxi) from Retail, then BL: GOTY isn't worth it - unless you get a great buy on it ($20 or less). You might as well buy the damn DLC directly-to-download from Gearbox Online Store, if that's the case.

I really wish for this game, they'll allow Retail Keys to be uploaded to Steam - since I'm trying to avoid Gearbox Online Store.

EDIT 2:

Yeah, that's a convenience I can appreciate. On the other hand, the DRM can be a tiny bit of an issue on PC but I think the DLC only needs a one-time registration and it's set. The questionable part is with uninstalling/reinstalling and revoking the tokens.

ALL of the BL DLC has Securom Internet Edition DRM w/ 5 installs + revokes allowed.
Securom -> Borderlands + DLC - DRM information.
Securom -> BL DLC Revoke Tool.

[Xessive]

Thanks for the Revoke tool info and links, MyD.

I've been messing around with the game files, comparing and contrasting the legitimate installation versus a "less-than-legitimate" installation. I've unistalled and reinstalled a number of times to find the best configuration for the game. Apparently mixing and matching Legit DLC downloads can cause some issues when you're using the NoCD crack:

-Original EXE + Legit DLC: game works but you need disc in drive.
-Crack EXE + Legit DLC: only base game works (no disc necessary) but game will crash when you try to access any DLC regions.
-Original EXE + not-so-legit DLC: game and DLC work fine but you still disc in drive.
-Crack EXE + not-so-legit DLC: game and DLC work perfectly fine, no disc necessary.

In conclusion (to reiterate) the pirate's path is technically the most convenient. I have the legitimate game but it's redundant to have the legitimate DLC installed because it does nothing but add inconveniences and potential issues i.e. "I forgot to revoke before my computer died."

[Cobra951]

There's no reason to use encumbered software when its unencumbered variant is readily available.  You paid for it anyway, and the publishers insist you paid for a license, not a product.  Use your finds in good health.  If I ever get another gaming PC, that's all I'm acquiring myself.  I already bought the game, er, "license" to play the game.

[MysterD]

Direct2Drive -> Borderlands: GOTY Edition [BL + ALL 4 DLC's] on PC = $14.95 today only.

[W7RE]

I've been thinking about this recently. One of the things that I sort of felt fell a little short in Borderlands, especially when comparing it to Diablo (or any other loot driven game) is the lack of visual variety in equipment. The only piece of equipment you ever see, on yourself or others, is the guns. And the guns aren't even all that varied. There's a pretty small number of model variations for each gun type, so most of the visual variety comes from color.

So what if Borderlands had been a 3rd person shooter, and you could have collected armor? Let's just assume the gameplay was still solid. Do you guys think the ability to see gear changes and ogle at your character would have added much, or is it really just all about the stats?

[Cobra951]

I've been thinking about this recently. One of the things that I sort of felt fell a little short in Borderlands, especially when comparing it to Diablo (or any other loot driven game) is the lack of visual variety in equipment. The only piece of equipment you ever see, on yourself or others, is the guns. And the guns aren't even all that varied. There's a pretty small number of model variations for each gun type, so most of the visual variety comes from color.

So what if Borderlands had been a 3rd person shooter, and you could have collected armor? Let's just assume the gameplay was still solid. Do you guys think the ability to see gear changes and ogle at your character would have added much, or is it really just all about the stats?

What?!  I have never seen a game with anywhere near the amount and variety of guns in Borderlands.  The game longevity is all about scoring the best of them.  You can respec characters to take advantage of particular weapons.  They look and act very differently from each other.  All about the guns.

The PC version of the game can be modified to go 3rd person.  I think it takes a change to an ini file.  You're right; you won't see any changes to the characters' appearance (but you should get better views of the guns being held).  The game didn't go there.  So you're right when you point out that the Diablo comparison only goes so far.  BL is a unique (and way too addictive) animal.

[idolminds]

I think what he meant was that there are only so many models for guns, so even if you get ones with vastly different stats you still sorta end up with similar looking guns.

For a Borderlands 2 I would like to see more armor options. Even if there isnt a 3rd person option, just seeing what other players in multiplayer are wearing would be cool. Also, having a button that will project a hologram of the stats of your currently held gun would be nice so you can show it to someone else without having to give it to them.

[Cobra951]

That's why I linked those threads, where you can see a great variety of guns close together.  Yeah, they all have triggers and barrels, but the combinations can get quite unique-looking.  And that's only the highly regarded weapons.  There's a lot of more plain gear that can look downright funny, like a combat rifle without a stock.

[MysterD]

I think what he meant was that there are only so many models for guns, so even if you get ones with vastly different stats you still sorta end up with similar looking guns.

For a Borderlands 2 I would like to see more armor options. Even if there isnt a 3rd person option, just seeing what other players in multiplayer are wearing would be cool. Also, having a button that will project a hologram of the stats of your currently held gun would be nice so you can show it to someone else without having to give it to them.

A 3rd person vanity cam would be cool - just so you can look around your character and check out your gear.

[W7RE]

I guess there's a little more variety in gun visuals than I remember, but still, the only thing changing is your gun.

I'm not sure I would have wanted Borderlands to be 3rd person, but I can't help but think if I had made the game, it would have been a temptation to make it that way just for the add of being able to have visually changing armor. In Diablo and even in WoW, sometimes you get all your armor and you really are impressed with how cool your character looks.

I keep thinking that it would have great if Borderlands had gone 3rd person and included all sorts of armor styles, but I'm not sure if the game would have been as good in 3rd person.



EDIT: The 3rd person vanity cam is a good idea. You' wouldn't get to watch your character all the time, but could pop out and see what others see from time to time.

[MysterD]

WTF @ Knoxx DLC.
My character Lilith is Level 40 [Tempest] and this DLC portion is scaled at 35.
What gives?

Why was the Level Scaled so low and beneath me?

[W7RE]

WTF @ Knoxx DLC.
My character Lilith is Level 40 [Tempest] and this DLC portion is scaled at 35.
What gives?

Why was the Level Scaled so low and beneath me?

I had the same problem, with pretty much every DLC. (well, haven't tried Claptrap yet, even though I bought it)

I was 42 or so when Zombie Island came out, and playthrough 1 was scaled too low, playthrough 2 was scaled too high. Knoxx was the exact same way. Moxie I barely touched, but it seemed to be scaled ok. If there's one department where they really messed up it's the DLC scaling. I'm wondering if they just assumed people would be playing through the content at max level and on playthrough 2?

[MysterD]

Gearbox Forums - About Playthrough 1 and 2 Leveling and Scaling.

Looks like Knoxx on Playthrough 1 is fixed and you should start that RIGHT AFTER doing Borderlands: Original Campaign.

What good is that for those who did Zombie Island [DLC #1] already? 

EDIT:
Interestingly enough, BL: GOTY - Steam version did not create a Shortcut to my Desktop.
So, I created a Shortcut of its Borderlands.EXE from the Steam version's game folder - and this version boots WITHOUT even Steam running. It doesn't force Steam to boot up!
For those wanting to run BL: GOTY - Steam version without using Steam, there you go!

 

[Xessive]

Gearbox Forums - About Playthrough 1 and 2 Leveling and Scaling.

Looks like Knoxx on Playthrough 1 is fixed and you should start that RIGHT AFTER doing Borderlands: Original Campaign.

What good is that for those who did Zombie Island [DLC #1] already? 

EDIT:
Interestingly enough, BL: GOTY - Steam version did not create a Shortcut to my Desktop.
So, I created a Shortcut of its Borderlands.EXE from the Steam version's game folder - and this version boots WITHOUT even Steam running. It doesn't force Steam to boot up!
For those wanting to run BL: GOTY - Steam version without using Steam, there you go!

Yep, it's the same with BF Bad Company 2 and a few other originally non-Steam titles.

[Quemaqua]

Super kickass information, thanks doods!

[Xessive]

I may have mentioned this in another thread but you can also install retail versions of games with serials purchased on Steam i.e. I can install Bad Company 2 from my brother's retail disc and use my Steam CD key. My theory is this applies to any game that has a non-Steam edition.

That's kinda one of the reasons why I prefer to get my digital purchases on Steam: I indirectly have the option of going with or without Steam.

[idolminds]

Interestingly enough, BL: GOTY - Steam version did not create a Shortcut to my Desktop.
So, I created a Shortcut of its Borderlands.EXE from the Steam version's game folder - and this version boots WITHOUT even Steam running. It doesn't force Steam to boot up!
For those wanting to run BL: GOTY - Steam version without using Steam, there you go!

Of course I would read this after the sale is over.

[Cobra951]

I'm surprised it's that easy.  It reminds me how easy it was to bypass the time-limit wrapper on unregistered Real Arcade games.  If there's a way to do this to most games, I would be more inclined to use Steam in some uncertain future when I have a gaming PC again.

[MysterD]

I may have mentioned this in another thread but you can also install retail versions of games with serials purchased on Steam i.e. I can install Bad Company 2 from my brother's retail disc and use my Steam CD key. My theory is this applies to any game that has a non-Steam edition.

That's kinda one of the reasons why I prefer to get my digital purchases on Steam: I indirectly have the option of going with or without Steam.

Oh, another question - do many of the recent EA Titles you buy on Steam actually allow for you to register their keys on EADM?

Probably worth a shot, too - if you are trying to avoid being forced to use Steam.

Some of the EA games that I've bought from say D2D or Amazon to download, they register right on EADM.

Examples:
EADM Games I've bought from D2D/IGN PC that can be registered on EADM - NFS: Shift, NFS: Hot Pursuit, and Medal of Honor [2010].

[Xessive]

Oh, another question - do many of the recent EA Titles you buy on Steam actually allow for you to register their keys on EADM?

Probably worth a shot, too - if you are trying to avoid being forced to use Steam.

Some of the EA games that I've bought from say D2D or Amazon to download, they register right on EADM.

Examples:
EADM Games I've bought from D2D/IGN PC that can be registered on EADM - NFS: Shift, NFS: Hot Pursuit, and Medal of Honor [2010].

Yep, my BFBC2 registers with EADM.. Although I'm not sure why I'd want to use it, Steam has better overall connectivity and download speed. EADM can download stuff and register games but the EA store doesn't open in it; also it has no connectivity options whatsoever e.g. proxy settings etc.

[MysterD]

Yep, my BFBC2 registers with EADM.. Although I'm not sure why I'd want to use it, Steam has better overall connectivity and download speed. EADM can download stuff and register games but the EA store doesn't open in it; also it has no connectivity options whatsoever e.g. proxy settings etc.

Since it registers on EADM, you have the option of basically having another version of the [same] game, in case something goes wrong w/ the Steam-version.

EADM games are easier to back-up than Steam games. Steam games, you'd have to use the back-up utility and take time to archive it [and compress it] - that's an extra step there. With EADM, you basically just copy your entire game folder as is - so for a reinstall, just run the SETUP file in the INSTALLER folder.

EADM is quite basic - though, it does a good job of what it does. It lacks the functionality and other features Steam has. One thing I like about - EADM don't require EADM running to run a game. Steam usually in most cases requires Steam running, just to run a game on Steam.

EDIT:
Nice...My Steam version of Burnout: Paradise - The Ultimate Box game-key registered right on EADM.

[Ghandi]

So I played through this a few months ago solo and it was fun, but now I'm playing it with two other friends and it's a completely different game.

I'm the soldier and the other two guys are the siren and hunter. I went for the healer spec, and have a mod for ammo regeneration. The past few days we have started to figure out how to work together to really kick ass and it's been a blast. It's fun realizing how to utilize your class and attack certain positions. I'll run in and set up an initial position with a turret, using my assault rifle to draw fire. Then I'll hit everyone with the shotgun when they get close as the sniper and siren start to take people out. My turret heals, so it's insanely helpful, and I can shoot my teammates to heal them. With the ammo regen it's free health essentially.

Lot's of fun. The only real downside is that one of us has to host a game, and there is a little lag for the non-hosts.   

[Xessive]

Oh co-op is amazing in Borderlands!

It's ideal if you can have people playing with minimal lag but we can cope.

[Cobra951]

Coop with friends is the only safe way to play with others in BL.  Playing with random strangers almost guarantees a fucked-up save file.  You can get broken missions or malicious items you can't get rid of easily.

[idolminds]

Hmmm...

A new patch coming September 9 for the PC version of Borderlands will add Steamworks support and will begin to test some new systems development studio Gearbox Software wants to incorporate into Borderlands 2.

"This technology, dubbed B-Test for this patch, is about increasing the relationship between you and us, " Gearbox president Randy Pitchford said as he announced the patch at a Gearbox panel at PAX. The new tech will send data back to Gearbox, letting them know "which guns suck", which areas aren't being visited and other info that, presumably, Gearbox can tweak.

---

I spoke to Pitchford after the panel and he clarified that the B-test may be used to test a two-way connection between players of that game and Gearbox, the intent is to test that tech so that we'll see it actually work and affect change and interaction post-launch in and around Borderlands 2. Pitchford emphasized to me that it would be a two-way connection but doesn't want to divulge more details or over-promise.

[Cobra951]

99.9% of the guns suck.  That's why it becomes an obsession to find the good ones.

[K-man]

When my friends and I play I hear "awww man this gun is BADASS" at least 10 times a session.

[Cobra951]

Lots of guns seem badass until you start discovering the real cream of the crop.  Then you leave 90% of what you find right where it is.  Heh.

[K-man]

i always keep some open inventory space for stuff to sell.  But yeah, as the game progresses you definitely get more picky.

[idolminds]

I picked up some badass SMG last night. Or at least I thought it was badass. High fire rate, high damage, good accuracy....then I fired it and it was those swirly/bouncy bullets. Screw that thing.

[Cobra951]

K-man, eventually, you're better off not selling anything, or your money counter could roll over into negative territory.  (The program uses a signed 32-bit integer to hold your money, so it rolls over at 2 gig hex.  Very dumb.)  If you die, and you see 9 numbers as what it cost to revive you, stop selling!

Twisted barrel, idol.  Ugh!  Whoever came up with that should be shot with it.

[PyroMenace]

Hey you guys up for Borderlands tonight? I'm about to head to sleep right now and I plan to be up by 7pm CST so we can play at around 7:30ish. Cool?

[K-man]

Man there's a severe jump in difficulty once you get to T-Bone Junction.  I blew through the claptrap DLC over the weekend.  That basement full of weapons you get as a reward is awesome.  i'll never be broke again!

[idolminds]

Yeah Im down for tonight.

[Cobra951]

Man there's a severe jump in difficulty once you get to T-Bone Junction.  I blew through the claptrap DLC over the weekend.  That basement full of weapons you get as a reward is awesome.  i'll never be broke again!

The Hyperion gift shop.  Yeah, I've found some good stuff there, though it may take a while farming for it.  (Loads of cash for what you don't want too.)  The Dividing Faults industrial area with the claptraps and bandits is also a good place to find some gear mid-game, particularly shotguns, machine guns and combat rifles.

I'm farming Crawmerax now with a cheat shield.  I finally gave up trying to get good against him honestly.  Damn thing kills me 2 out of 3 times, and I lose a ton of cash in the process.

[Quemaqua]

I'm down for tonight, definitely.

[MysterD]

Borderlands PC adds Steam Cloud Save support and stat-tracking w/ Patch 1.42 for Steam version.

Okay, w/ all the extra Steam support for Borderlands: Steam Version [PC] and since DNF required Steam, anyone else wanna bet that Borderlands 2 will require Steam? 

[PyroMenace]

You think so? You maybe right, you are pretty psychic with these steam annoucements.

[MysterD]

You think so? You maybe right, you are pretty psychic with these steam annoucements.

I just have this funny feeling BL2 will require it, given all the love Gearbox has given the Steam version of Borderlands w/ adding Steam-features [Achievement support and now BTest and Steam Cloud Save support] AND also have this feeling, since DNF required Steam.
Plus, you can add BL: GOTY Edition [Retail] optional up onto Steam - it is NOT listed on Steam's Key page, but it worked for me w/ The Amazon DL version.
And we all know how well BL sold on Steam, too - especially during Steam sales.
It just seems...like they are heading in that direction.
Granted, I could be wrong - but, this just seems like it could be very likely to me.