Topic: Company of Heroes patches are ridiculous

[scottws]

I know idol is a fan of those small patch to a previous patch patches.  I prefer the big releases that update to the newest version no matter what you have.  Why?  Games like Company of Heroes. :

• 1.2 to 1.3
• 1.3 to 1.4
• 1.4(updates any version to 1.4)
• 1.4 to 1.5.1
• 1.5 to 1.5.1
• 1.5.1 to 1.6.0
• 1.6.0 to 1.6.1
• 1.6.1 to 1.7.0
• 1.7.0 to 1.7.1
• 1.7.1 to 2.101
• 2.101 to 2.102

That list doesn't even scratch the surface on the Opposing Fronts expansion patches which, I'm sure you can imagine, are much the same.  It also raises some questions like: "How do you even get on version 1.5 to begin with"?

To get to the newest version of the game, 2.102, you need to install the game then install patch 1.4, then 1.4 to 1.5.1, then 1.5.1 to 1.6.0, then 1.6.0 to 1.6.1, then 1.6.1 to 1.7.0, then 1.7.0 to 1.7.1, then 1.7.1 to 2.101, then 2.101 to 2.102.  That is completely ridiculous.

Edit:  It gets easier, but also hairier... I checked out the official website for the game.  There are a few additional patches listed there that Fileshack doesn't have:

• 1.2 to 1.4
• 1.4 to 2.101
• 1.7 to 2.101

I also found a patch from 1.4 to 1.7.0 on my hard drive.  Let's go over the full list of available patches then:

• 1.2 to 1.3
• 1.2 to 1.4
• 1.3 to 1.4
• 1.4 (updates any version to 1.4)
• 1.4 to 1.5.1
• 1.4 to 1.7.0
• 1.4 to 2.101
• 1.5 to 1.5.1
• 1.5.1 to 1.6.0
• 1.6.0 to 1.6.1
• 1.6.1 to 1.7.0
• 1.7.0 to 1.7.1
• 1.7.0 to 2.101
• 1.7.1 to 2.101
• 2.101 to 2.102

That's insanity.

Interestingly, the official website doesn't list 2.102 as a download for the original game.  In fact it is one of those version 1.5 kinds of things where there is a patch from Opposing Fronts 2.102, but not to it.

Anyway, with the discovery of the 1.4 to 2.101 patch, it obviously makes getting to the newest version a whole lot easier.

[Pugnate]

Oh god, don't even get me started on this shit. The CoH DRM is worse than STEAM and EA's crap put together.

I reinstalled CoH Opposing Fronts a few days ago, and basically it wouldn't let me play even the SP portion without updating to the latest version! This was despite having logged into the CoH servers with my cd key registered user name.

No, I didn't do anything the wrong way... it is just how it is with CoH, and how it has been since patch 1.4 or so. You must verify your cd key online by loggin in with a username attached to your cd key, and even to play a SP campaign you must update to the latest version.

Unfortunately, I had no idea how FUCKING FAR I was from the latest patch when I reinstalled Opposing Fronts. And since there was no giant patch, the game would download a patch for 30 minutes, and then have me restart, only to inform me that I needed another one! Even worse was that each patch would take at least 5 minutes to install! This went one for 4 hours! Absolutely unfuckingacceptable!

So I went online to see if people were as outraged as I was. Amazon.com was full of people upset.

But then come the goddamn fanboys. On the official forums, I saw some dude complaining, only to be attacked by a dozen fanboys, asking why he wanted to play the SP anyway... One person said, "Well, if you are going to be playing the SP version, wouldn't you naturally want to play the latest version?"

I just shocked by how people were defending this insanity. They just start defending these design decisions from angles that make absolutely no sense.

A while back I was talking about how PC gaming has lost its charm and every minute thing has become so frustrating.

Imagine setting things up for a LAN party, only to find that you must jump through hoops only to play some CoH on LAN.

Later I learned that you can play your SP portion of the game directly without any mandatory patching, when not connected to the net.... but it was too late.

[scottws]

OMG, it's mandatory?  That's crazy.  1.4 to 2.101 is almost 2 GB in size.

[iPPi]

I wouldn't expect to have to go through all that crap unless it's an MMO.

[Pugnate]

To play MP it is. To play the SP portion it is, if you are online. I had no idea about "if you are online" part, and so didn't a lot of people. I also had no idea it was 2GB of patching, which on my connection (1MBPS) wasn't fun.

When I started CoH, it would simply give me an option of updating, or quitting.

[MysterD]

Geez, I have both CoH + Opposing Fronts, ain't even looked at EITHER of them.
Well, all that patching looks...well, quite OVERLY ridiculous and all.

I'm guessing Tales of Valor acts like this, as well possibly?

EDIT:
The only nice thing about something like Steam or Impulse is...well, it updates your game to the newest version all by itself -- regardless of what version you have installed. Ain't gotta worry about installing 50 patches after each other and all.

With Steam or Impulse, you can back-up the newest version to CD/DVD if you decide to uninstall the game. If you need to reinstall, you can start right with your back-up CD/DVD. You ain't gotta do the patching process again.

Idol's thing with patches having small updates -- that's really only any good if there ain't many patches out for the game.

[Xessive]

I recall going through all that jazz a couple of months back. Luckily I had collected the updates as they came out and I only had to download one of the huge, gig-sized updates.

I've gotten into the habit of archiving patches and updates, that's why I have a problem with game auto-updates that don't allow you to store the downloaded updates. G4WL being the most annoying autopatcher since it just hangs there and doesn't give you any info on how big the download is. Luckily you can find the file in the temp folder and back it up for future reference.

[MysterD]

I recall going through all that jazz a couple of months back. Luckily I had collected the updates as they came out and I only had to download one of the huge, gig-sized updates.

I ain't looking forward to all this CoH updating, when I decide to get into the game! :oP

I've gotten into the habit of archiving patches and updates, that's why I have a problem with game auto-updates that don't allow you to store the downloaded updates. G4WL being the most annoying autopatcher since it just hangs there and doesn't give you any info on how big the download is. Luckily you can find the file in the temp folder and back it up for future reference.

I do that, too. Usually, though -- I grab a patch when I'm about to buy a game and take the latest patch. Usually, though -- most games, their patches don't require you having any previous patches.

Witcher Version 1.5 does require 1.4 installed (Enhanced Edition), though.

[Xessive]

Incremental and comprehensive updates have clear positives and negatives. Both methods should be used circumstantially.

I think UT3 and CoH are the extremes of each. All UT3 updates are comprehensive, meaning that every minor update will require to download the full patch; Idol expressed how irritating that was in an earlier thread. CoH on the other hand has everything incremental , big or small. I personally believe Relic should have aptly made the significant updates comprehensive i.e. v1.0 to v1.7.0 and perhaps a v1.0 to v2.101.

I am noticing now with my PS3 that LBP updates are all incremental as well. At one point I hadn't played LBP for a couple of months and when I finally put the disc in to play some it said it needed to download approx. 11 updates! They amounted to something over 400MB and you can't even download them in thbe background. I am glad for the fixes but I wish there was some way to download updates manually for the PS3.

[Quemaqua]

There should be both iterative patches and always an up-to-date complete one that includes everything.  Always, no exceptions.

[MysterD]

I side with Que 100%.

[idolminds]

I also agree with Que. I like the incremental updates because why redownload shit you already have? Thats stupid. But they should also have large total updates available. Those are great for archiving or new users, or people reinstalling. I generally back up the incremental updates and name them so its easy to just power through applying them.

[Xessive]

That's what i generally resort to doing, except with certain games (like UT3) that have complete, comprehensive patch files.

I still like the idea of both methods though, the way Blizzard does it with WarCraft 3: you have the incremental patch i.e. v1.4-1.5 ~3MB and the comprehensive one i.e. v1.0-1.5 ~50MB.

It's nice to have the option but if I had to go with just one I'd rather have full, comprehensive patches.

[scottws]

So I never did bother with CoH when I made this thread.  But last night I went ahead and installed it.  Then I installed the 1.0 -> 1.4 patch, then 1.4 -> 2.101, then 2.101 -> 2.102.

Then I tried to run the game.  In the game menu, it said I needed another several hundred MB patch and downloaded at installed it automatically.  I checked the version after that and I was at version 2.201.  So I went on the site and downloaded these patches:

2.202 -> 2.300
2.300 -> 2.301
2.301 -> 2.400
2.400 -> 2.500
2.500 -> 2.501
2.501 -> 2.502
2.502 -> 2.600
2.600 -> 2.601

Luckily this didn't take too long because I have a 20 Mb down connection, otherwise I would have been pissed.

I went ahead and started installing the remaining patches in order.  All went well until patch 2.500 -> 2.501.  It kept telling me that the file WW2Art.sga was corrupt in the patch file or the existing file wasn't the expected version.  I tried to run the patch again with the same results.  I deleted the patch and downloaded it again again from the official site with the same result.  I tried to run the 2.400 -> 2.500 patch again, but it said it was already installed.  I tried to extract the EXE for the previous patch to see if I could grab 2.500 of the WW2Art.sga out of there, but I couldn't figure out how.

I tried launching the game, but it said I needed to download a 1.34 MB patch.  I went ahead and did this, but all it does is download and install the Relic Patch Download Manager, which is a P2P patch downloader.  I see it running in the System Tray, but it is not transferring anything up and down.  It also seems to have no GUI and no options.  I can't even right-click the icon in the System Tray and exit.  If it does anything useful, it certainly doesn't show or act like it.

I tried launching the game again and it wanted to download a 1.34 MB patch again.  I did this, and it just reinstalled the Relic Patch Download Manager again.  I tried launching the game and pressing cancel on the same patch download, but it requires me to log in.  If I have an account, I don't remember what it is.  I tried all my standard logins and none of them worked.  For some reason, both the Create Account and Forgot Password buttons were disabled.

I did find that I was able to get into the game if I had the CD in the drive and I disabled my network card.

This is easily the most fucking ridiculous game installation I have ever had.  What the fuck is Relic thinking here?

I submitted a support case to Relic for the problem (something I haven't done since I had trouble installing and running games in the early 90's), but I have a feeling they are going to just have me jump through the bullshit hoops in the following KB article:

http://support.thq.com/thq/consumer/kbdetail.asp?kbid=354&SearchType=advanced&referrer=&gpn=&CustID=&bUseEditor=&keyword=error+10104&rfield=&sortmethod=rel&usertype=&gpv=&catID2=&formaction=search&catID1=&IncludeHTML=&catID3=&TotalResults=259&submitbutton=Go&match=and

[Xessive]

Oh man, I never understood why Relic wouldn't make comprehensive patches.

I used to worry about it, in fact I still have the update DVD I made last year (a full 4GB of nothing but CoH updates) just in case. Since I got CoH on Steam (it came with the THQ deal pack) I haven't even thought about it; sure it does take a while to download and update it but I don't have to do it manually. I think that's the concept Relic was trying to impose with the built-in "RelicDownloader."

[MysterD]

So, are they gonna re-release the game up-to-date on disc w/ COH + OF + TOV?
Man, that patch BS is crazy - with tons of required updates.

Only nice thing about the Steam version is it'll get you all up-to-date and all, since Steam auto-updates and all. At least w/ Steam, you can run the Archival back-up Utility and back the entire thing up-to-date w/ whatever the newest version is when you actually Archive it.

[Pugnate]

Going through this thread rekindled the feelings of when I went through this nightmare again. Really, this is one of the few games I'd rather have on Steam. But that's also because the patching is stupid.

[MysterD]

Going through this thread rekindled the feelings of when I went through this nightmare again. Really, this is one of the few games I'd rather have on Steam. But that's also because the patching is stupid.

I have a funny feeling those COH games might wind-up on sale on Steam this week....
It's THQ Sales Week on Steam this week.

[Ghandi]

Going through this thread rekindled the feelings of when I went through this nightmare again. Really, this is one of the few games I'd rather have on Steam. But that's also because the patching is stupid.

Yeah I think that I paid $2.50 for it on Steam and was playing it in 10 minutes or so.

[Pugnate]

Yea I got the games for my sis on the Steam sale. Maybe I should have bought myself a second Steam copy.

[gpw11]

I loved CoH.  I bought the gold boxed version a few years after release and played the shit out of the main campaign.  I then started to play the expansion, but ran into some problem requiring patching.  After solving that, something with the whole online log in for singleplayer (or something) went south and I think I lost my saves (or something to that end).  I threw the disk in the garbage and never looked back.

[Pugnate]

You threw the disc in the garbage?

[gpw11]

You know hoarders?  I'm like the exact opposite.  If I'm not going to use something again I'll probably give it away or throw it out.  At that point I decided I was done with CoD for good.  Should I ever change my mind, I'll download it.

[scottws]

I reinstalled the game and all the patches went in this time.

What's up with the Relic fanboys and these patches?  They are blaming memory problems, disc drive problems, everything but the patching process itself.  I should never have to completely reinstall the game because the 98th patch out of 100 won't install.  There shouldn't even be 100 patches.

[Xessive]

The only other time I have experienced a ridiculous amount of patching is with MMOs. "Download the full client and start playing NOW!!" My ass... Some MMOs have a 4GB client download but then need to download another 3GBs of sequential updates when I open the launcher.

[Pugnate]

I reinstalled the game and all the patches went in this time.

What's up with the Relic fanboys and these patches?  They are blaming memory problems, disc drive problems, everything but the patching process itself.  I should never have to completely reinstall the game because the 98th patch out of 100 won't install.  There shouldn't even be 100 patches.

haha yea... why can't they just make one giant patch?

Next time the CoH set is on Steam for $3 or whatever, I'll be getting it.

[Xessive]

haha yea... why can't they just make one giant patch?

Next time the CoH set is on Steam for $3 or whatever, I'll be getting it.

It could be some time this week! It is THQ Sales Week on Steam after all.

[Pugnate]

Sweet.

I didn't realize the THQ thing would continue with a new sale every day for the week. I thought it was a one day thing when I glanced at it.

[scottws]

Here is THQ's response to my support question about the error I was getting the first time I was trying to install the patches:

Thank you, Scott, for contacting THQ Customer Support.

The game needs to be completely patched before the system will allow you to create an account or log in. The 10104 Error code indicates that the file it is attempting to patch is corrupt.

So far the only solution has been to fully uninstall the product, run a Clean Boot, and then reinstall the game and patches manually.
Best regards,

Chris B
THQ Customer Support
http://support.thq.com

So, not only does COH's installation process blow donkey nuts, but its fraught with issues and the only thing you can do is uninstall and try it all again!  Amazing.  I'm a PC gamer to the core, but this is just not something I accept as "part of the PC experience".  This sort of thing shouldn't be happening with a big, modern game.  It reeks of the 90's.

[MysterD]

@Scott

That's crap and lazilness. There should always be a way to update from original box to final patch - even if it's a freakin' huge patch.

Does Steam accept COH Retail CD/DVD Keys?

EDIT:
Nope, Steam doesn't - and that's bullshit, too.

[idolminds]

Heh, sounds like what Steam support tells me. "Delete the game and redownload." Yeah, like thats ever really an option for me.

I feel for you, scott. Relic has probably the worst patching system I've ever seen.

[MysterD]

Heh, sounds like what Steam support tells me. "Delete the game and redownload." Yeah, like thats ever really an option for me.

Question: Can someone say [somewhat] near you who has a fast connection say sign into your Steam Account on their PC w/ a fast connection; DL the game for you on their PC; and back it ALL up on disc(s) for you w/ Steam utility in its most patched-up state; and then give it to you?

I feel for you, scott. Relic has probably the worst patching system I've ever seen.

Maybe it's one of the reason DOW2 requires Steam.

[Ghandi]

Here is THQ's response to my support question about the error I was getting the first time I was trying to install the patches:

So, not only does COH's installation process blow donkey nuts, but its fraught with issues and the only thing you can do is uninstall and try it all again!  Amazing.  I'm a PC gamer to the core, but this is just not something I accept as "part of the PC experience".  This sort of thing shouldn't be happening with a big, modern game.  It reeks of the 90's.

TL;DR: If the first install didn't frustrate you enough, try again! We definitely aren't looking into this.

[idolminds]

Question: Can someone say [somewhat] near you who has a fast connection say sign into your Steam Account on their PC w/ a fast connection; DL the game for you on their PC; and back it ALL up on disc(s) for you w/ Steam utility in its most patched-up state; and then give it to you?

We don't use the Steam backup utility (it seems to leave a lot of files out), but yeah that works.

[MysterD]

We don't use the Steam backup utility (it seems to leave a lot of files out), but yeah that works.

Any clue what the hell it leaves out? 
Is it certain Steam files needed?
Or is it just game files specific to each game?

[Xessive]

Actually they don't have to do the Steam Back-up utility thing. You just need the folder. That how we set it up here for the Steam users: I already had it all downloaded and up-to-date so we just copied my folder onto a passport harddrive and transfered to whoever needed the files. If I wanted to go the extra mile I could zip/rar it then make a self-extractor that installs it into the Steam\steamapps\common folder.

After that, once you run the game from Steam it registers it and makes sure it's running properly. Just in case it's a good idea to tell Steam to check the files by click "verify integrity of game cache" in the game's Steam properties.

What I like about the way Steam does things is that the game files are centralized and each user's saves and configs are stored in the user's profile only, so it's safe to copy/paste and also not have duplicate installs on one system.

[MysterD]

Company of Heroes 1 is moving entirely to Steamworks on May 7th b/c Quazal is shutting down.

So, if you still got any Retail CD/DVD Keys for COH, COH: OF, and/or COH: TOV - you'll be able to activate those up on Steam.

Also, click here for what the new upcoming COH Steamworks version will support & will not support.
 

[scottws]

Cool that you can register the game on Steam and not have to worry about the stupid patches.

[Xessive]

Cool that you can register the game on Steam and not have to worry about the stupid patches.

That was the one tedious thing about CoH: the massive bunch of patches you had to download and install sequentially!