Topic: Smartphone Megathread. It's the shit.

[gpw11]

Smartphones.  I can't stop reading about them.  I'd love to go back to a cheap ass dial and text PCS phone, but I needed a smartphone for work/school email access and customizing it got me hooked.  Now I check sites multiple times a day.  Fuck me.

[Pugnate]

I got a Samsung Innov8 a month ago on my birthday. I love it, but I haven't totally utilized it. Any suggestions?

[Xessive]

The Innov8 is great but since it's SymbianOS you're pretty much limited to Java apps. Which is not very limiting There are plenty out there!

I've been on Windows Mobile since I got my Samsung Omnia. I love that phone. I've been using custom firmware with for a while now. I get most of my apps from FreewarePPC. They might have some stuff for Symbian but I'm not sure.

I recently wound up with a Sony Ericsson Xperia X1. It's got much higher resolution than the Omnia but it's lacking in other aspects. So far it's greatest feature is the physical slide keyboard. So much easier and more comfortable to use than any on-screen soft keyboards.

I'm pretty hooked on mobile devices now too. While I'm not a fan of Windows Mobile in and of itself, the customizeability and the 3rd-party stuff you can get for it are treasure.

[beo]

ah yes, i've been waiting for a thread like this...

i recently got the htc hero (known as the "G2 touch" on t-mobile). it's the latest phone based on google's android os and is now my favourite toy.

the interface is fantastic, with a modified version of the standard android ui. customisable widgets such as rss feeds, music players, weather, clocks, contacts, etc. the customisation available on this device is pretty great.

some of my other favourite bits are:

• google maps (including street view), with gps.
• facebook integration with phone contacts, which gives you status updates, album viewer and loads of other bits.
• last.fm and shoutcast radio, so virtually unlimited music via 3g access
• 5mp camera
• bbc iplayer - live and recorded bbc tv
• one touch facebook and twitter (uurgh) uploads, so you can stick embarrassing pictures and vids up before you think better of it. this also works with "geotagging", which means it can automatically put in location information via gps.
• msn, aim, google talk and skype
• gmail integration
• web browser with flash support
• layers - an app that uses the camera and overlays various pieces of information about your surrounding area, such as bars, restaurants, shops and local points of interest.
  
• android marketplace - since android is open source, there are hundreds of completely free apps that cover pretty much anything you can do on a pc - including scummvm, snes, gameboy and megadrive emulators.

the only real downside of it is the processor could be a bit more powerful, so the device is subject to a tiny amount of lag if you try and do too many things at once.

[Quemaqua]

How much do these things cost?  I shudder to think.

I actually have decided to get back to the world of cell phones.  I sort of need one for stuff now, and it's probably best to just stop avoiding the inevitable.  But laziness and not wanting to research phones has thus far halted my progress entirely.

[beo]

How much do these things cost?  I shudder to think.

as with most phones over here, mine was free on an 18 month contract. i understand that you're looking at around $200 plus a 2 year contract for most smart phones in north america, however.

[Quemaqua]

I don't do contracts.

[K-man]

I've had a Blackberry Storm for work for a few months now and I already want to punt it long distances.  Not because it's a Blackberry Storm, but because it's a fucking work phone.  I had a work phone for around a year before this but at least i didn't get email on it.

[gpw11]

The Innov8 is great but since it's SymbianOS you're pretty much limited to Java apps. Which is not very limiting There are plenty out there!

I've been on Windows Mobile since I got my Samsung Omnia. I love that phone. I've been using custom firmware with for a while now. I get most of my apps from FreewarePPC. They might have some stuff for Symbian but I'm not sure.

I'm rocking an Omnia as well, although I can't load up custom firmware with it because there aren't any custom roms that will work with Telus' CDMA towers yet for some reason.  I'd like to get WM 6.5 on that bitch, but for the time being it all works out simply because Windows Mobile is so customizable if you're willing to put a bit of work in. 

Originally I really wasn't a fan of WM6.1, and as a result, the phone but having learned more I'm really liking it. Blackberry for me wasn't really an option because of the specific retention deal I got and the fact that I doubt I could renegotiate to a new BB data plan for anywhere near the same price as what I pay now for unlimited.  The iPhone is a similar deal because I'd have to switch carriers and lose what little leverage you can have with these fuckers. Besides, iPhone isn't really a productivity device and this came with MS office included (great for viewing, horrible for editing anything but Excel) and far better email support. The 5 MP camera is alright, but LED flashes suck balls and I just bought a 10MP pocket cam that this doesn't really compare to.

All in all, I really like it and it's the best option I could go with at the time (no HERO yet and the Touch Pro 2 wasn't out yet).  Still, I  think I'll probably upgrade far before my contract ends. How are the slide out qwerty keyboards?  Touch screen is kind of a bitch, but to be honest, I can't really see those tiny tiny keys being all that much better.

[Xessive]

Sweet. I wasn't a fan a of WM6.1 either but, as you said, with a little bit of effort the customisation pays off. So far my favourite part is the comprehensive and universal contact list. Speaking of which, if you get a chance grab PIM Backup, it's the best and most reliable contact/sms/note backup utility I've seen yet on WM. Saved my ass a few times.

The Omnia's camera is decent but, as with all phone cameras, they don't compare to an actual dedicated camera. They're great for "Oh, I wish I brought a camera!" situations.

It's too bad about the Telus CDMA incompatibility. Honestly, you're not missing too much; WM6.5 is a tiny bit more finger-friendly and the custom jobs have refined some of the WM woes, but in the end it's essentially the same.

The slide keyboard on the Xperia is pretty good actually. It took a bit of getting used to at first and now I'm comfortable with it. It matches a compact laptop keyboard, even sporting a FN (function) key to use a numpad or certain symbols. I have small hands so I'm not having any trouble with it but I can see how people with big hands might have a bit of a challenge with it, at least until they get the hang of it.

My Xperia is black, but this shot will give a good look at the keyboard:


One other thing I like about the Xperia is that it's metal. It feels nice and solid, and it can take a hit.

Btw, I've installed Skype on both phones and it works really well! It's pretty handy and can save a bit of cash when you can connect.

[gpw11]

Yeah, it does kind of suck about the ROM incompatibility, but it's not a huge deal.  Custom skins, themes, and mods make minmo 6.1 far more touch and user friendly so that helps quite a bit. My only major complaint about anything is that WinMO was built for PocketPCs, not phones.  The standard GUI is not finger friendly at all, and once you start getting into the depths of some of the windows menus it can really get noticable. Beyond that, Telus is upgrading their network right now and is supposed to launch an HSPA network in the coming months.  I may end up getting one of the first WinMo7 devices on the new network once they start hitting, probably a year or so for now. 

[Pugnate]

I didn't get the innov8 because it was a smart phone specifically, but because it had an excellent 8.1MP camera on it. This is the first phone I have had where I can say the camera compares to a cheap digital camera. I did some research before buying, and pretty much bought it because of the camera reviews. I travel a lot during my work day, and come across lots of interesting things to take pics of. My K850i was pretty crap for taking pics, so I am pleased with this.

For anyone interested, here it is:

http://reviews.cnet.com/cell-phones/samsung-innov8/4505-6454_7-33232668.html

I also love how it looks; I think it looks quite smart.

It has all the other stuff like gtalk, msn, facebook, cnn player, google maps etc... but I am not really interested in that unless I am traveling far.

Hey, anyone know where I can download games? Would love to play Quake etc. on it.

One thing I do like is that it has a little touch sensitive square that functions as a mouse touch thing, like you find on laptops.

[gpw11]

http://www.nokiasymbianthemes.com/free-mobile-games/quake-3-arena-nokia-game

I think you'd have to just kind of google around until you find a good place that hosts .jar apps and games for Symbian.  It's popular, so it should be easy.

The omnia also has a little "optical pad" but it's not great.  Basically, instead of a laptop like trackpad, it's a piece of glass or plastic with an optical mouse behind it.  It's not bad by any means, but it's kind of too small to be fully accurate as a mouse and because of the design it doesn't make a good directional pad.  This is the way the technology seems to be going, and it'll probably get better but for right now a trackball is probably more accurate.

[Cobra951]

I can play solitaire and breakout on my nearly 3-year-old phone.  Woohoo!  Don't need extensions to my fingers to hold it either.

Actually, that's my iPod.  Never mind my brain farts.

But I still like the size and shape of my phone much better than all these smart ones'.

[iPPi]

The convenience of the smart phone is that it has everything you need and you don't need to carry additional devices.  I remember that before the advent of smart phones, I had to carry a normal cell phone, mp3 player, and PDA with me.  That's just too much crap to be carrying sometimes.

I'm still using a normal cell phone, but luckily it has mp3 playing capabilities and I just live with that. 

The data plans in Canada are ridiculous and require 3 year contracts so I have refused to purchase a smart phone yet.  I'm still undecided as the market has become flooded with them.

[gpw11]

To be honest, I do like the smaller form factor of regular phones more.  Ippi does have a point though (even though I don't use it for music at all).  For me it's mainly the PDA functions and access to email/the internet/exchange whenever and wherever. Well, that and I like to play around with stuff like this faaaar too much.

[Pugnate]

I am thinking of either going for the Samsung i8910 Omnia HD or the Samsung M8910 Pixon12...

Omnia II is also an option, but as best as Samsung tried to cover it on the phone, Windows Mobile is still a sluggish nightmare.

[gpw11]

Thought about Android at all? 

I haven't noticed Windows Mobile being all that sluggish, but I believe that's more of a 6.5 problem.  Either way, it isn't finger friendly at all until skinned and I'd personally stay away from it until we see what Windows Mobile 7 brings us.

I'd hold off on a phone until after the big Mobile World Congress (or something like that) show this month.

[Pugnate]

Yea come to think of it the Windows Mobile phone I tried was 6.5

So far the Omnia HD is looking brilliant...

Yea I may just hold off.

As for Android, it is still early days yet, though I am interested.

edit:

Should be said that Sony Ericsson have really dropped the ball. I used to buy only SE, but it seems they decided that rehashing old products was a great idea. I had the k700, the k750 and then the w800... that's when their phones started going to hell. The 3mp K800i was an embarrassment with its terrible camera censor actually on the same level as the 2mp K7 and W8 series. It only looked good on the camera, but the image quality was pretty poor on screen.

Then there is the build quality, where every SE phone I've had has developed some fault or another. A lot of SE phones were squeaky and felt like toys. SE started developing a bad rep even on their fansites.

Nowadays SE seems to be in deep deep trouble, and I am not surprised. There are rumors that SE may close within the year, which would be well deserved.

[gpw11]

I was under the impression that Sony Ericsson was kind of coming back with the X10 (or something like that). No idea though, the phones usually aren't offered here so I don't really know anything about them.

I didn't realize the Omnia HD is running Symbian.  I don't have any experience with that, but it seems like it may be a good way to get around the WinMo problem.  Besides that, the screen and camera seem to be some of the best on the market - although it is rocking a resistive touchscreen (I think) unlike, say, The iPhone or Android devices.  But yeah, I'd imagine a good phone either way.  I can attest to the build quality of the Omnia series as I put my Omnia through a lot.  My only gripe is that the TouchWiz interface doesn't do nearly enough to cover up Windows Mobile, but that wouldn't matter on Symbian and may have been fixed with the Omnia 2.

But yeah, either way, I'd just wait to see.  I mean, you could play the waiting game forevet, but it always sucks to buy something and then see something far more awesome announced the next week. 

[iPPi]

The SE X10 looks nice.  I am actually considering getting the X1 though, since it's cheaper now in Canada.  That said, smartphone selection in Canada leaves a lot to be desired.

[Pugnate]

Yea the Xperia X10 might be really sweet. It might be the Android phone we are waiting for...

Overall, SE seems to be in trouble. From what I read they have made some big losses, and have had overall revenue drop to half.

They pretty much revolutionized the camera phone market, but for some reason started doing incremental camera sensor technology upgrades when they went further from 2MP phones, and basically started using the "megapixel" tagline only for marketing. Some of their 3MP phones ended up producing poorer shots than their 2MP counterparts. It wasn't long before the consumers caught on.

Compared to them Nokia kept improving in terms of quality. The build quality for SE phones was quite terrible and I read that they were surveyed to be the worst in the K750 era. Then LG, Samsung etc suddenly started putting out quality products and SE suffered even more.

It is sad because at one point SE revolutionized the mobile market, with their cybershot line very profitable.

Yea the X series looks really good, but the vast majority of the profits seem to come from the mid range phones.

BTW, my sister bought a Nokia 5230 yesterday.

It is an great set at $160.

The camera is pretty standard, but it is a touchscreen smart phone that looks good and is an amazing buy at that price. It would have been unheard of, to buy such a good new Nokia phone for less than $200 a few years ago. A sign of the times I guess.

edit:

Looking at the Xperia specs, considering that it is rumored to be priced so high, it is disappointing that its screen is a 65 000 color TFT. You'd think it would be AMOLED.

[gpw11]

I don't know what the deal is with it, but I think we're right in the phase in period of AMOLED.  It seems that a lot of big phones don't have it, which is really weird.  I'd imagine it's all depended of when the phone was first starting to be designed or something. 

[gpw11]

In somewhat related news, Google is either about to or just did release an over-the-air update for the Nexus One allowing multi-touch functions in all native programs. I'd imagine this will be present in all future Android releases and will probably be backrolled onto older phones like the Droid/Milestone and Hero. Notably, these phones all have multi-touch out of the box in every other region (and possibly Canada).

People had been wondering why American releases never had multi-touch gestures, but it looks like it's mostly been sorted out.   It seems like Apple and Google had a gentleman's agreement regarding multi-touch on Android - something that's disappeared now that their relationship is turning sour fast.  I believe Apple does claim to hold some patents, but that hasn't stopped anyone else and they still haven't touched RIM or Palm over it.  Microsoft will probably also be walking all over that with Windows Mobile 7 (I think there's a software limitation preventing it in WM6.X even if the hardware is there).  Looks like another "Fuck You" from Google.

Adobe is also piping up, saying that Flash 10.1 for smartphones is almost ready - allowing for complete in-browser flash support (huge deal).  Expect full platform support for everyone....except Apple because those two are still in a pissing match.  Apparently Apple won't let Flash anywhere near the iPhone because you could  launch applications and games without having to go through the app store.  Not only would Apple never approve of such a service in the App Store, the entire program would be against the TOS of the iPhone/app store. Adobe has been pretty vocal about this, which is probably wise because....well, everyone wants flash on their iPhones. Apple's side of the story is that Flash is too buggy (probably true), and Adobe is lazy (I don't know where that comes in).   

[Pugnate]

I have a question. Why the hell would any company want to name their phone HTC "hero"?

[beo]

yeah, htc do choose some notoriously stupid names for their android phones. most carriers usually have the common sense to rename them before sticking them on the shelves.

[Pugnate]

I guess they thought there was going to be some overlap between the Guitar Hero and Smartphone user crowd.

[Pugnate]

http://blog.gsmarena.com/samsung-to-show-off-a-new-phone-with-new-better-amoled-touchscreen-at-the-mwc/

Can't wait to see what gets released on Feb 15.

[gpw11]

Yeah, that's awesome.  Wonder if it's resistive or capacitive. I'm looking forward to what is going to be shown as well.  I've been putting a bit of money aside because I think I'm going to need to upgrade SOON.  I don't know what the fuck is going on with my Omnia, but that motherfucker has just been draining the battery while in standby, which could eventually be a problem.  I usually keep it in my car over the work day (since I started going to school full time again, I no longer get paid a phone allowance...which is totally cool, but don't expect me to use my minutes for work), and most times it can drop from anywhere between 30-40% of the battery just sitting there over 8 hours. I have no idea what the fuck is doing it.  I've replaced the battery (no go, but at least I have two now), soft reset the phone, uninstalled everything and ran it clean, and for the most part it seems like nothing helps.  I don't know if it's normal or if it's something to do with my providers ROM but I'm throwing down a three strikes rule - the third time I need my phone and it's dead I'm just deep-sixing it and getting a new one.  Luckily, I haven't hit the first strike yet. Thank god for car chargers.

Do smartphone batteries just die very fast like that?  I mean, I expect to have to charge daily with a smart phone, but for the battery to drop so substantially while it just sits there seems strange.

Anyways, it'll be interesting to see what comes at the MWC.  I'm torn on what OS to go with. WinMo 6.x is great in that it's customizable and there are free apps for absolutely everything, but the stock UI blows hard and it is very very dated at this point.  Not finger friendly at all.  The rumours of WM7 sound mixed.  On one hand, apparently the new UI will be great and it'll be a very good mobile operating system...on the other there are rumours of no backwards compatibility and possibly no multitasking. BC is a must with Windows Mobile since most of it's functionality comes from the fact that you can open, edit, and pretty much do anything on it.

Android seems great, but I'm going to wait and see.  If WM7 doesn't do what I need, I'll probably go with this.

The iPhone; wicked multimedia phone, not so great smartphone. I already have two iPods, and it just doesn't seem to have the same level of organizational and productivity software I need.  No editing office documents?  I'm out. No flash at all, probably ever?  I'm out. That and it's not nearly customizable enough for me.

Blackberry.  Very tempted, except I'm hard on my phones and they don't put up with that well.  A lot better now that they don't use the actual trackball anymore, but I'd still worry a bit about build quality.  I already know of a few people who are having problems with their new Bolds (although they are fucking awesome).

So we'll see.  I'd also like to get something with a hardware keyboard....just, you know, not too big.

[Pugnate]

I think something may be up with the phone. They shouldn't die lie that. You don't leave a lot of apps running in the background, do you?

Anyway, here is some info on Win7mobile...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/technology/8515915.stm

edit:

This Bing push is getting lame. Bing sucks.

[Pugnate]

Wow check out the Samsung Wave:

http://www.mobile-review.com/review/samsung-wave-s8500-en.shtml

What the hell is BADA?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bada_%28operating_system%29

Here is a coverage of the phones Samsung launched:

http://www.gsmarena.com/mwc_2010_samsung-review-452.php

Windows 7 mobile impressions:

http://www.engadget.com/2010/02/15/windows-phone-7-series-hands-on-and-impressions/

Here is a video review of the wave:

http://www.engadget.com/2010/02/14/samsung-wave-first-hands-on-bada-packed-and-super-fast/

Like the comments said... it looks like a mashup of the android and iphone OS.

BTW, just learned that yes Windows Mobile 7 will not have Flash, which is disappointing...

OK what the hell... this is the Samsung Beam:

http://www.engadget.com/2010/02/15/samsung-beam-halo-hands-on/

It has a projector, 8MP camera, SuperAMOLED display... and Android 2.1

Sold yet?

Here is the Windows 7 mobile press preview:

http://www.microsoft.com/presspass/presskits/windowsphone/videoGallery.aspx

[gpw11]

Nope usually nothing running in the background.  It could be because I have the phone skinned...and then have the skin skinned on top of that so it looks roughly like this:

http://forum.xda-developers.com/showthread.php?t=604146



Some people have complained of battery drain on some phones using the skinning program, but after removing pretty much everything and testing it running clean, there wasn't really any difference. What could be doing it, that I just thought of, is it's constantly connected to the internet. Like, my data connection is connected from the second the phone boots up until whenever I shut it down or reset it.  That could very well have something to do with it I imagine.  I'm going to look for a setting to only connect when it gets a request from a program and see if that helps.  As for the rest of it, I'm going to go through the links in your post and reply again. Just got back in town and there is too much info I've missed.

[gpw11]

Okay, checked out a bunch of stuff:


The Samsung Wave looks sweet.  BADA turned out very nice, which I'm kind of surprised about. I was under the impression that it was something that was going to be on their low and mid-low end devices, but apparently not. I could see there being some downfalls associated with it, but for what it is, it looks awesome and it kicks the pants off of Touchwiz as it is now. Samsung's biggest drawback on their current phones is that their custom OS layer over Winmo/Adroid isn't up to par with, say, HTC and I'm not sure if BADA even has the ability to run over something, but it looks like it could work as a fully functional smartphone OS of it's own.  I don't think it would be as open as Adroid/Winmo, but I doubt it will be any more limited than the iPhone OS (although it wouldn't have the same level of support).  Interesting for sure.

Samsung's hardware continues to impress with both the Wave and the Beam. Kind of dissapointed that there wasn't an announcement of anything with a keyboard like the Omnia Pro (which also had the best standard homescreen of any winmo device), but the interesting thing about cellphones is that even with huge trade shows like this, new stuff is announced and released soon after all year long.

Windows Mobile 7.  The interface looks awesome, but I don't know if it's for me.  I'll have to see what happens as more and more is released, but it looks like it's being targeted for mainstream consumer use rather than business/productivity.  IE competing with the iPhone rather than Blackberry. Nothing wrong with that, and probably the smart direction to take.  What might kill it for me is that it doesn't seem to be as customizable or open as Winmo 6.x is. New skins, homemade apps, that kind of thing.  We'll see what happens, but the design...wow.  Probably the best interface design I've seen in the smartphone market.

One thing I've found interesting is that SPB Mobile shell...a very popular and awesome skin for Winmo 6.x (what I used for the the screenshots above) is now going official.  It's preloaded on Toshiba phones and SPB MS 5.0 is going to work on Android and Symbian as well as Winmo.  Kind of cool and I can't wait to see what they can do with the dollars to put some more polish in.

[Pugnate]

Yea, the Samsung hardware looks amazing. The Beam seems quite impressive, though the projector looks gimmicky.

I like the look of WM7, but if they are going to be offering a consistent experience, I can't imagine it being very open as you say.

The interface is pretty amazing, I agree. I'd like to see a Samsung phone running that OS. The hardware of Samsung matched with that would make a great phone.

There is something about Samsung phones UI that always feel a little off... I don't know.

[gpw11]

Yea, the Samsung hardware looks amazing. The Beam seems quite impressive, though the projector looks gimmicky.

I like the look of WM7, but if they are going to be offering a consistent experience, I can't imagine it being very open as you say.

The interface is pretty amazing, I agree. I'd like to see a Samsung phone running that OS. The hardware of Samsung matched with that would make a great phone.

There is something about Samsung phones UI that always feel a little off... I don't know.

I agree completely.  All of my personal phones have been Samsung because they make durable and Quality hardware.  That said, their custom UI's and smartphone interface overlays are always a bit off as you say.  The biggest disappointment with my Omnia (apart from whatever the fuck has started going on with my battery) has been the TouchWiz widget interface.  I don't use it ever. BADA seems like a huge step up. 

I can't figure out what the deal is with BADA though.  I know it can be run as it's own OS as in the Wave (and open-source as well), but it's hard to say if it can be used as an overlay.  The Beam looks to be running something very similar over Android, but all I can find on it is that it's called "Touchwiz 3.0". Same thing?  No idea. 

[Pugnate]

Yea I was confused about the Beam because its interface looked almost exactly the same as the wave. I thought it was the Bada running on top, but it turns out they configured and customized the Android 2.1 to look as similar to the Bada on Wave as possible.

I am not sure why they did that, because it confused other people as well and seems a bit weird in terms of product positioning.

Essentially it seems the Wave is the Samsung Jet, except with a better interface/OS.

More on BADA:

http://www.mobile-review.com/articles/2010/bada-strategy-en.shtml

What Samsung have going for them is bucket loads of money. They are a very rich company so it looks like they are investing a lot in the hardware. I am glad they are investing a bit more now in the software.

[gpw11]

I think that article explained it...I think.  BADA isn't an operating system, it's a platform. That still didn't make sense to me, but I guess what they're saying is that they can run BADA on all their phones, regardless of the operating system.  So, it could be on Android phones, Winmo phones (well...not 7 I guess), and Symbian. They can also run it as an OS on their own phones, but that's not really the point.  The point is to unify the interface across all Samsung phones regardless of the operating system...I guess to promote brand familiarity?  I don't know, I'm still confused.

What I did find interesting, though, is that apparently with BADA, apps can be developed across operating systems, so any BADA app can run on any BADA phone regardless of the OS.

What the fuck?  I'm still confused.

But yeah, Samsung has a shit ton of money.  I believe they are the largest electronics company in the world now and one of the largest companies in the world (not sure if that's by market cap or by revenue or both). They've been pushing out great hardware for a while now, but, like you said, if they start pouring resources into getting the software up to par this could really be something.

[gpw11]

Didn't know this was a possibility



Of course, it doesn't play great considering games have to be made specifically for touch screens, but with the right game I think it could work well.

[Pugnate]

Canada Trust. The only bank that gave my a credit card despite being an international student, having applied to like 50 banks.

[Xessive]

Awesome..
I tried out a SNES emulator on my Omnia that basically put a touch SNES pad on the screen. It was ok but not ideal.