Topic: Obamacare

[Pugnate]

http://www.motherjones.com/mojo/2012/06/obamacare-supreme-court-regular-americans

[Xessive]

11) Free birth control and other preventative services for women, unless you work for a faith-based organization that opposes birth control.

Ha, I can imagine some pretty ironic situations

[idolminds]

There was an interesting post on reddit of someone explaining a lot of what the bill does.

[Pugnate]

I am pleased for Obama. It is really sad it took it nearly the end of the first term to happen.

[Cobra951]

My only big problem with it was, and still is, the mandate.  Think about it.  We voted for the man out of a desire to get a comprehensive healthcare system paid by progressive taxation, to achieve parity with the better industrialized nations, and instead what we got was a state-enforced obligation to enrich the same abusive private system we wanted to abolish or at least neuter.  (The value of insurance stocks has ticked upward since the Court's ruling.)

I don't know yet how this will all work, but so far, indications are that the rules will be similar to Medicaid's:  It doesn't matter what I earn, but what the household that I'm a part of earns.  In other words, although I cannot in any way afford medical insurance, and no one in my family can afford to pay for it either, if my mother's household earns enough income, then I don't qualify for free insurance.  I'll still be obligated to buy it as of 2014, which equates to paying the penalty (since I won't be buying what I can't afford).

The net result is that while I hate both political parties and their agendas, the Democrats are currently scaring me more than the Republicans.  I'll learn as much as possible about the upcoming rules before November, and see if my fears can be laid to rest.  Otherwise, ironically in the extreme, given our country's history so far this century, I may end up voting a straight Republican ticket.

[gpw11]

My only big problem with it was, and still is, the mandate.  Think about it.  We voted for the man out of a desire to get a comprehensive healthcare system paid by progressive taxation, to achieve parity with the better industrialized nations, and instead what we got was a state-enforced obligation to enrich the same abusive private system we wanted to abolish or at least neuter.  (The value of insurance stocks has ticked upward since the Court's ruling.)

I don't know yet how this will all work, but so far, indications are that the rules will be similar to Medicaid's:  It doesn't matter what I earn, but what the household that I'm a part of earns.  In other words, although I cannot in any way afford medical insurance, and no one in my family can afford to pay for it either, if my mother's household earns enough income, then I don't qualify for free insurance.  I'll still be obligated to buy it as of 2014, which equates to paying the penalty (since I won't be buying what I can't afford).

The net result is that while I hate both political parties and their agendas, the Democrats are currently scaring me more than the Republicans.  I'll learn as much as possible about the upcoming rules before November, and see if my fears can be laid to rest.  Otherwise, ironically in the extreme, given our country's history so far this century, I may end up voting a straight Republican ticket.

Quick question:Why don't you guys have free health care? Like I get that politicians are assholes and insurance lobbyists suck balls, but at this point why haven't people taken to the streets and flipped cars? Aside from Tea Party retards, how is everyone else being placated in an age where pretty much every other civilized country in the world has some form of socialized health care and it's viewed as a universally good thing?

It seems like a concept that I could previously grasp (when I was in my early twenties and nothing was ever going to happen to me ever), but am having a harder time figuring out now.

[idolminds]

“You can always count on Americans to do the right thing - after they've tried everything else.” - Winston Churchill

[angrykeebler]

Quick question:Why don't you guys have free health care? Like I get that politicians are assholes and insurance lobbyists suck balls, but at this point why haven't people taken to the streets and flipped cars? Aside from Tea Party retards, how is everyone else being placated in an age where pretty much every other civilized country in the world has some form of socialized health care and it's viewed as a universally good thing?

It seems like a concept that I could previously grasp (when I was in my early twenties and nothing was ever going to happen to me ever), but am having a harder time figuring out now.

Because...ummm....

uhh


i dont know.


can i come live with you? i'll even be a canucks fan

[Pugnate]

But would the Canadians have you?

[angrykeebler]

maybe i'll be an illegal alien! how about dem apples?

[Cobra951]

Quick question:Why don't you guys have free health care? Like I get that politicians are assholes and insurance lobbyists suck balls, but at this point why haven't people taken to the streets and flipped cars? Aside from Tea Party retards, how is everyone else being placated in an age where pretty much every other civilized country in the world has some form of socialized health care and it's viewed as a universally good thing?

It seems like a concept that I could previously grasp (when I was in my early twenties and nothing was ever going to happen to me ever), but am having a harder time figuring out now.

As nearly as I can tell, because of the huge victories from the relentless lobbying and scare tactics that the right wing has been engaged in for many years.  The word "socialized" is practically equated with Marxist-Leninist communism in the minds of many voting dopes.

Keebs' comment was meant as a joke, but I'm totally serious about inquiring into how to become a permanent Canadian resident.  I am now 58.  I am still generally healthy, but it is almost a certainty that I will need healthcare increasingly in the coming decade(s).  I read that some parts of Canada with low populations could use people with some skills.  I guess therein lies the rub.  What skills, and what is accepted proof of them?  Maybe I should just seek political asylum?  The American healthcare system is condemning me to an early grave? 

[scottws]

Yeah, I read the Obamacare rules, and it just looks like it is going to line the pockets of insurance companies more.  What is going to stop them from raising premiums even more as they are forced into more coverage?

What we got is very different than Obama's original vision.

[ren]

As nearly as I can tell, because of the huge victories from the relentless lobbying and scare tactics that the right wing has been engaged in for many years.  The word "socialized" is practically equated with Marxist-Leninist communism in the minds of many voting dopes.

Keebs' comment was meant as a joke, but I'm totally serious about inquiring into how to become a permanent Canadian resident.  I am now 58.  I am still generally healthy, but it is almost a certainty that I will need healthcare increasingly in the coming decade(s).  I read that some parts of Canada with low populations could use people with some skills.  I guess therein lies the rub.  What skills, and what is accepted proof of them?  Maybe I should just seek political asylum?  The American healthcare system is condemning me to an early grave? 

The oil companies in Alberta are basically hiring people for every skill. I know many people who were unemployed for months in other parts of the country and got instantly hired to the first place they applied to out west. Saskatchewan is also having a bit of a resource boom and accepting lots of workers. Unfortunately our government has decided they don't like immigrants so it's much harder to get in than it was just a few years ago.

[gpw11]

The most reliable but least user friendly site to look at

The simplest way (besides from being a french catholic willing to live in Quebec or getting married) would be to become a skilled worker/perminent resident for however many years (five maybe?).  There's a list of something like 30 profressions/areas of profession that turn easy mode on for the whole process, but it isn't limited to that list, you just may have to arrange employment before you are granted residency status (I think).  After that, you can apply for citizenship.

Like America, there's a bunch of categories with a bunch of point values that are used to assess the viability of potential immigrants based on age (by far not the biggest factor...yet), employment history, education, etc. I'm sure you'd do fine there.

[quote Unfortunately our government has decided they don't like immigrants so it's much harder to get in than it was just a few years ago. [/quote]

I don't really know if that's true.  Numbers haven't gone down and the only changes to immigration policy lately have been changes in the demographic targeted, aiming more at younger skilled workers or those with applicable experience to the current job market rather than giving massive amounts of points for holding dual masters degrees in Basket Weaving and Egyptology.  The goal is to dynamically fill gaps in the job market rather than just let people in on the merits of "well, they have some education...they'll probably find a job".  It actually should open the doors for some who were previously unable to get in.  A shift, rather than a reduction.

There has, however, been an overhaul of the refugee system, but that basically entailed tightening up some loopholes, kicking bogus claims out faster, and bringing Canada up to international standards in those regards.

[Cobra951]

Thanks for all that.  I'm taking a look at your link right now. 

[ren]

I don't really know if that's true.  Numbers haven't gone down and the only changes to immigration policy lately have been changes in the demographic targeted, aiming more at younger skilled workers or those with applicable experience to the current job market rather than giving massive amounts of points for holding dual masters degrees in Basket Weaving and Egyptology.  The goal is to dynamically fill gaps in the job market rather than just let people in on the merits of "well, they have some education...they'll probably find a job".  It actually should open the doors for some who were previously unable to get in.  A shift, rather than a reduction.

There has, however, been an overhaul of the refugee system, but that basically entailed tightening up some loopholes, kicking bogus claims out faster, and bringing Canada up to international standards in those regards.

That's fair. I'll concede, what I said was mostly driven out of ideology and not facts. As an immigrant myself with many immigrant and refugee friends, family and coworkers, I dislike when anyone gets turned away, even if there's a completely logical economic argument behind it.

[shock]

What's funny to me is that this is an enormous win for insurance companies and big business, yet Republicans are opposing it for no real reason other than the Democrats passed it.  As 103901923 people have pointed out, the mandate was originally a Republican idea.  And one that Mitt Romney loved.  And now all of a sudden, IT'S EVIL.

I have no problem making people pay a penalty/tax/whatever you want to call it for not getting health insurance (assuming they can afford it).  They are eventually going to get sick like everyone else.  And when they can't pay their $10k ER bill, those losses gets passed onto the people that have insurance.  It's a broken system.

So I'm not a huge fan of the law because I think it is too business-friendly and not focused enough on health.  But it is at least better than what we had before.  And it is looking like the federal government is going to have a lot of control over the insurance companies (limits on their overhead, strictly limiting their policies and benefits, etc).  If they keep moving in that direction, it won't be all that different from a truly universal, government run healthcare system.